Is Flash dead?
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- Projectile0
I just spent a few hours today creating animated banners in flash. Output as HTML5, job done.
I'm glad I spent all my efforts learning the timeline interface and ignoring action script!!
- vaxorcist1
Chrome starting to default pause flash ads...
- err1
Yes thats what Im talking about!
"Chrome will will strongly favor HTML5 ads and begin pausing most Flash ads by default starting Tuesday. That's today!"The verge.com's homepage has a big ass microsoft flash ad on their homepage.
- fues0
It's over and out now, 80% of the specheets I receive are HTML now.
- utopian0
Adobe Flash just took another step towards death, thanks to Google.
- zarkonite0
https://arstechnica.com/informat…
"The rise and fall of Adobe Flash. Before Flash Player sunsets this December, we talk its legacy with those who built it."
- PonyBoy3
lol... nice bump
I just scrolled back through this thread and the ignorance of where things were moving was high w/some us (put me at the top of the list)... I'm glad listened to some of you and refocused on the existing browser tech along w/a focus on a mobile...
...it was not easy to let go of Flash.
- Projectile9
I made this fairly recently in Flash using HTML5 output.
Worked great, just couldn't get it to autofit.
- Krassy3
what's Flash?
- https://en.wikipedia…)sted
- " https://en.wikipedia…) "sted
- "https://en.wikipedi...sted
- bwahahah qbn fuckoffsted
- e n . w i k i p ed i a. o r g / w i k i / F l a s h _ ( co m i c s )sted
- ah, got itKrassy
- https://images-na.ss…Krassy
- https://en.wikipedia…renderedred
- https://www.urbandic…PonyBoy
- zaq2
I got nostalgic.
I will probably get old Egomedia animations from backup and see if I can convert them to HTML5 or even simple videos.- I still have some old .fla files from my Balthaser days, I'm guessing best way would be to screen capture?moldero
- It'd be more fun to re animate in AE thoughmoldero
- You can republish FLA to HTML with Adobe Animate pretty easily, though I haven't fired up that app for over a year now.evilpeacock
- trip? does it deal with scripted animations well? or is it just timeline animations?moldero
- There was a plugin that did it for CS6 too, that seemed to work with scripts.PhanLo
- https://www.youtube.…PhanLo
- I've not done it with anything that was heavily scripted/interactive... Mostly just timeline-based animation. There will be quirks, but it worked well for me.evilpeacock
- Nairn6
Well, if nothing else, this thread highlighted this for me..
https://www.qbn.com/reply/313049…
For some reason, I thought that deathboy was only a recent and mostly negative phenomenon, but apparently s/he's been here at least a decade.
- In his old posts he actually seam like a normal person.PhanLo
- https://www.qbn.com/…
idk :Dsted - It appears that with the death of Flash, his zest for life and his dreams died as well.utopian
- ^ lol!!dorf
- like the skidmark in your favourite underwear that just refuses to completely wash out.face_melter
- You can see the beginnings of his contrarianism "actually Flash is better on mobile"yuekit
- Nairn0
19th October, 2020 - the day I finally uninstalled Flash after being prompted to by Adobe themselves.
Goodbye.
- Nairn16
MONOSPACE: Flip dots with feelings, a JavaScript demo in 1021 bytes, winner of the 1024 bytes demo competition at Assembly 2020.
Due to a bug in Firefox, it's best viewed in a Chromium or Webkit-based Browser (boo. mozilla!)
1021 bytes. Wow.
- that's acefadein11
- insanemicrokorg
- damnmoldero
- Math be crazy.ideaist
- Where's Mono?
Did he create this?CyBrainX - http://www.p01.org/M…imbecile
- ^
don't click that link if you're on Firefox, it could require you to restartNairn - (the browser at least, not your OS)Nairn
- Monos arguing with someone somewheremoldero
- Still not as good as Flash. But quite fun.PhanLo
- It's an aside to Flash and shows what can be done 'on the metal' (lol) in JS. But given the entire package less than a 1kb in size, it's 'better' than Flash.Nairn
- Steve Jobs was correct in rejecting Flash for something better; lightweight and powerful.ideaist
- ...Only took 10 years.ideaist
- Yeah, the shame is when Flash imploded, so did the editing tools that eventually output to JS/etc and so the whole culture dissolved.Nairn
- I say this lots - but I'm still perplexed why there's not a whole ecoystem of Flash replacemnt tools enabling animation and complexity from a timeline.Nairn
- Still can't actually draw animations and generate systems quickly in any other program.
I did download Touch Designer the other day though.PhanLo - Yeah, that's exactly the problem. I keep meaning to check out GreenSock - I *think* it has a timeline editor?Nairn
- These days performance will always be better direct-in browser, compared to a Flash-like layer. As you say though, there're no fucking tools to do itNairn
- Flash was great for its time but fundamentally antithetical to the way The Web Should Work, and therefore everything going forward.Nairn
- It's been a full decade and there isn't anything quite like Flash as a replacement. I think it's fair to say Jobs was wrong.CyBrainX
- been getting Flash-backs doing ES6 Javascript... feels like AS3 open source Flash days but i'd take the Flash IDE any day over the HTML5 DOM, SVG and CSSkingsteven
- this demo is incredible. female voice on my browser - gonna have to look in to that web speech APIkingsteven
- You can do a lot (if you're patient) w/HTML5 / JS / SVG... thing is nobody is 'asking' for it these days. Everyone wants to edit their own site / have a blog.PonyBoy
- Nairn... GS will blow your mind but you have to have a little patience w/it (mainly cuz there's so much you can do w/it now) but it is simple to grasp if...PonyBoy
- ... you understand basic JS syntax (basic function calls w/ parameters, variables etc).PonyBoy
- GS is a godsend for HTML5 banners... so much $$ and time saved / made thanks to Greensock... I've yet to find anything that compares.PonyBoy
- Am I missing something? Adobe Animate is the evolution of the Flash app no? i.e. it does the same but exports as HTML5/CSS3/JS. I haven't used as like someonefadein11
- said above no one asks for it anymore (unless banner ads which have better solutions). The interface is pretty much the same. I did a few tests a while back andfadein11
- seemed good but not had to get stuck into Flash type stuff for years. Has anyone used it much here?fadein11
- Simple animations are easily done with CSS3, so no need. But I think Animate caters for stuff like the example here more.fadein11
- but not under 1024 bytes obviously :)fadein11
- utopian0
Windows 10 update removes Flash and prevents it from being reinstalled
- That was a time...the flash years. Personally I am glad it is dead. Too much power in one program.dkoblesky
- Goodbye. Thanks to Flash I was able to put food in my stomach and roof over my head.shapesalad
- ^OBBTKN
- renderedred1
Great news for everyone concerned about the Flash end of life planned for end of 2020: The Internet Archive is now emulating Flash animations, games and toys in our software collection.
- in a way, Flash years were the best www years, now most website design is limited by frameworks...grafician
- Heavy.com |v| 1teh
- @grafician agreed, Flash was a blank canvas for interface design, for better or worse but allowed for limitless creativityspot13
- it's death was limitless vulnerability... but I loved it.hotroddy
- What ruined web design was the introduction of the iPhone. Everything had to work on big and small screensdkoblesky
- dkoblesky2
My take on this....interested in other thoughts.
Flash was very dependent on CPU speed to work. People that worked on desktops with the fastest CPUs designed them. The work could be great, but only on desktop where the CPU did the work.
Along comes the iPhone, which had a CPU with a fraction of the power of a desktop CPU. But it surfed the web so it *seemed* like it should run flash sites but really could not for the most part.
Steve Jobs, master marketer, knew this. He did not want to have his new baby look like it could not run the most advanced websites, so he came up with his famous letter in which he refused to put Flash on the iPhone....citing security, battery life, crashes, etc. He never came out and said 'look, the iPhone cannot run these sites because they are designed for desktop computers which are ten times faster than the iPhone.' He made it look like it was a Flash problem. Genius deflection
Everything in web design changed within months. A colleague of mine who was always cutting edge immediately killed his flash portfolio site and redesigned in with just HTML. He knew what was happening.
In the end, it was really inevitable. The proliferation of mobile devices that were slower and ran on less bandwidth meant that the design world had to adjust. Thus mobile friendly flash-less web sites became the norm.
I remember that Google made noises that the Android would run Flash anyway, despite Jobs statement, but they probably did this to fuck with Apple and get some publicity. In the end Android never really ran Flash either.
Could Adobe have done something? Probably, but they would have had to immediately make Flash so it could produce lower bandwidth and CPU intensive designs. But they were Adobe, so moved slowly. By the time they even came up with anything....i remember some feeble attempts to do something....everyone had an iphone or android phone in their pocket and web design was all mobile friendly and HTML only. Flash was practically dead by then.
- Adobe is the only company that could have saved flash. Blaming Apple so retardedly ignorant.monospaced
- I love when you create a discussion and someone downvotes it without saying anything. LOLdkoblesky
- Blaming a device that had less than 2% of the phone market is so childish and stupid it’s not worth a sentence let alone this whole write upmonospaced
- I am not 'blaming' anything...where do you get that?dkoblesky
- If your argument was correct (it’s not) then the phones that DID run flash (most of them) would have succeeded. But adobe didn’t care. At all.monospaced
- Oh....you think I am bashing Apple? I did say Jobs was a marketing genius...wasn't that enough?dkoblesky
- Steve wasn’t wrong btw. Flash didn’t work on mobile phones. It sucked for web seo. It was left behind. By adobe.monospaced
- what is your take on the death of Flash then monospaced?dkoblesky
- Adobe didn’t make a mobile worthy product and never adapted it to work on android or iOS.monospaced
- Remember. Flash isn’t an Apple product. It sucked foe mobile. Proof is that it failed even with MAJORITY MARKET SHARE FOR A DECADEmonospaced
- Adobe is to blame. They fcuked up Macromedia!grafician
- Wanna bet Macromedia would've found a way to run Flash on mobiles and make it great? Adobe just bought Macromedia to kill the competition.grafician
- Now Adobe lost the product design market, the iPad market, even Photoshop is not #1 for many workflows, fuck em!grafician
- If somebody replaces Ae with a good app, Adobe will be dead in 3-5 yearsgrafician
- Continuity4
I think it's a little unfair to lump all of the blame for Flash's demise on Apple and Steve Jobs.
Without a doubt, he had a lot to do with it, but there was also the fact that technologies — notably HTML, CSS and jQuery — were evolving concurrently, to the degree that they were taking away some of Flash's lustre.
The thing with Flash, though, is that it was already under heavy assault — long before Jobs jumped on that bandwagon — from this cunt:
Jakob Fucking Nielsen despised Flash. In fact, he despised anything on the web that didn't add up to his idea of how it should look and work. Hated originality, hated great design, hated the experimentation that made the period from 1999 to 2003 so awesome online.
And guess what? He fucking won. If the web now looks like one giant same-y WP template, we really have him to thank for it. Steve Jobs came in years later with his iPhone rationale, but really, Flash was already fighting a losing battle against Nielsen.
- If you read what I wrote I am not dunking on Apple or 'Steve'. It was a reality that Apple dealt...that was very Steve Jobs. I said 'genius'dkoblesky
- The worship of Steve Jobs clouds people's mindsdkoblesky
- No one 'won' or 'lost'. Technology changed. People had to adjustdkoblesky
- No, no, I'm not saying you're dumping it all on SJ. It's a very popular narrative online, though, that it was Jobs that did for Flash.Continuity
- When, really, it was much more that arsehole Nielsen.Continuity
- Uh this guy also has been hating on PDF for well over a decade and that’s doing just finenb
- He's anti-PDF, too? Christ.Continuity
- Hmm, while Nielsen made a splash, outside of prof web, no one would ever know who he was. The iphone, on the other hand, dictated people's lives in tech.formed
- Except that web usability is baked into web design....and he and others made that happen.dkoblesky
- Nielsen? He was the antithesis of good design. Did you see his website back then? It was all a horrible joke that insulted good design.formed
- This guy wanted to sell a book and that's what he accomplished. He was a ton of hype. Jobs killed Flash. Flash was evolving just as much as trends in CSS and JSCyBrainX
- ...and it was infinitely easier to use for a lot of things.CyBrainX
- No one can defeat that foreheadpango
- Jobs didn’t kill flash. Adobe did.monospaced
- ^ yep, when they hired neilsen. i think this episode was all before iPhones existedkingsteven
- I always thought he was a joke. "Weblinks must always be the same color". Usability taken to the extreme where everything is the same.Nutter
- ^ He always came across as a frothing at the mouth culty.Continuity
- https://i.ebayimg.co…adrok
- nb1
You’re insane if you think there weren’t behind-the-scenes meetings for many many months where Jobs tried to strong arm Adobe into investing their own resources into making Flash that could work on iPhone. Or, to make something that would produce Flash-like content but not kill the iPhone experience and battery life.
You think Apple just walked out with the iphone one day and was like “ok here’s our new product, hope y’all hate Flash with us now, our company depends on it!”
Have you even worked for a company before.
- Apple in the end bet that people would prefer the iPhone to Flash and they were right. Nobody cares about Flash except the people who worked in itnb
- Maybe all that happened. Doesn't change things. Jobs is still a 'genius' ok? Of a sortdkoblesky
- Jobs is 100% the exec who is like “why are we spending Apple money to help make Adobe successful? Fuck Adobe. We work at Apple.”nb
- I work for one of the largest companies on the planet....ok?dkoblesky
- And that’s completely what he’s supposed to do as the leader of his company.nb
- this is why I called him a 'marketing genius'
Adobe is who failed heredkoblesky - Amazing how personal people get about global conglomeratedkoblesky
- Um, yeah I agree with you. The letter and all that was a way to control the conversation when Apple started to lose control of the narrative.nb
- What nb said is correct. iPhones (mobile devices in general) beats Flash. But this forum cares because many of use worked with Flash for 10 yearsdkoblesky
- Then why did flash not flourish on android which had the majority market share globally for many years before and after iOS???monospaced
- Simply put, if flash was gonna live on mobile it failed to do so on the platform it was allowed on. And adobe shit the bed. They failed.monospaced
- iPhone had a slim market share for years. It was a joke at first. Why blame the underdog for a shitty flash not working on it? Pshhhhmonospaced
- nb5
To some extent, those of us who are nostalgic for the Flash days are looking at it in a good light. We're looking at the creativity, the fun, the possibilities and all the great work that came out of it.
We're ignoring all the mind-numbing bullshit and browser-crushing ad garbage that came along with it. The endless "this website has a script that is causing your computer..." or whatever. The beachball of death because of an embedded ad on a myspace page.
For me, some days I look at the web and hate what it's become. We replaced our world of bloated Flash (that at least allowed creativity) with bloated front-end frameworks (that were designed specifically to save money by reducing creativity.)
We're lazy, and we're letting fucking software engineers dictate culture.
- (Almost) everything is a generic, scrolling pile of images and text all made for a phone. It's damn boring.formed
- I went to siteinpire and clicked on 10 websites - all the same, all boring and ugly on a computer. Sad.formed
- Jobs did a marvelous job of killing it, but alas, I do own Apple stock and, from a biz perspective, it was brilliant.formed
- I think we are seeing the end. With the exception of massive sites, Wix, etc., will kill the small/med firms.formed
- AI will kill it all. It'll be here in 5 years. Check out what openAI are doing with text to code to site.shapesalad
- I don't miss Flash. Shit animation tools. Was happy to go back to AEdkoblesky
- A lot of creative work came out of that era but you have to ask what was the return on investment on all of those Flash sites? Did anyone visit them more thanyuekit
- once? People use the web to get stuff done, if they want an immersive experience there are other mediums that are better for that.yuekit
- For a time a lot of artists had a wonderful (somewhat) code free interactive playground...easily distributed to lots of people....that does not exist anymoredkoblesky
- Art vs money. A classic debate. Money wins the battles but in the long run, art wins the war.nb
- I never got the dis on Flash, it was awesome! I think the hate was from jelly devs. Long live the flash intro!atomholc
- Html5 can do most of what Flash did except the comic-style vector animations and characters that nobody really wants to see any longer.NBQ00
- In the end the internet has become mostly about simplicity, minimalism, clean navigation to focus on the content. I don’t want goofy intros anymore on websites.NBQ00
- And Joshua Davis can go fuck himself.NBQ00
- Agree with post and that this trancends Flash; HTML/CSS/JS sites can do open + performant creative things, but the market has pushed to templated CMSs.evilpeacock
- https://www.samuelda… petty similar to old flash sites, except you grind your scroll wheel..shapesalad
- I made more money in the early 2000's building Flash based website than in the past few years building HTML/CSS/JS sites. Fuck you Apple.utopian
- I look back on things like Hell.com and what Hi-Res was doing with sites and can see what some of you are saying. There's still tools to get that type of workben_
- done, but there seems to be way fewer risks being taken these days.ben_
- fwiw I don't even remember if hell.com was flash, but that spirit is the thing I'm referring to.ben_
- https://www.albinobl…cherub
- The internet is boring now. The way people like it. Stripping your data in a soul-less uni-style. Folk love it though.
Never underestimate people love of boringPhanLo - Hi-Res was doing some inspiring stuff. With mobile driving everything these days, it's all but killed web design, imho.formed
- grafician0
^pretty sure Flash was dead when you needed to learn Actionscript to do anything good with it...
Don't blame Steve, blame fucking Adobe for buying Macromedia to kill the competition and in the process ruin the web.
Blame also the shitty advertising industry, although many earned a lot of bread doing flash banners and stuff...
- still remember getting $250 per flash banner back in the days...grafician
- Nobody ever mentions that for years all those banners didn't allow using AS3 because their tracking was AS2-based.evilpeacock
- not to mention the insane optimisations like "make it under 200kb" while today a simple blog loads 10MB of jsgrafician
- I had to spend days to optimise assets, JPG 60-75% tops if you wanted anything decent looking while still small filesize, while today ppl upload 10MB directlygrafician
- idk but I think Flash was an amazing medium for design and web art, didn't deserved to be squashed by these big corporations...grafician
- People don’t use 10MB of JS in a banner adnb
- lol nb have you opened any website on mobile recentlygrafician