RIP Mobile Flash
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- ukit20
Thought this was interesting, from Adobe's blog post
“We will continue to leverage our experience with Flash to accelerate our work with the W3C and WebKit to bring similar capabilities to HTML5 as quickly as possible...and, we will design new features in Flash for a smooth transition to HTML5 as the standards evolve so developers can confidently invest knowing their skills will continue to be leveraged.”
"for a smooth transition to HTML5"
I think people are being short-sighted saying Flash will be around forever and ever. Adobe is talking about desktop Flash here, and making the transition to a standards-based approach. If you read between the lines, Adobe seems to be saying they are eventually leaving Flash behind altogether.
- You could guess a lot of scenarios from that paragraph. I for one, feel somewhat comforted by the tone of it.CyBrainX
- mikotondria30
MM... It shouldn't really be beyond any of us to be able to rattle off some OO script, but also have strong animation skills. Our working lives are straddled between the stark left-brain reality of packets and ports and electrons and 1s and zeros at one end, and people unaware of this process going 'oooh, that's cool', or 'ah, thats just what I need, that suits my need' at the other. We translate client experience into minute voltages which we encode and launch onto a network. We all need at least a basic understanding of the whole process. There's no reason to abandon the concept of the all-rounder who calls on non-all-rounders to knock out specialist sections of this process.
- mikotondria30
MM... It shouldn't really be beyond any of us to be able to rattle off some OO script, but also have strong animation skills. Our working lives are straddled between the stark left-brain reality of packets and ports and electrons and 1s and zeros at one end, and people unaware of this process going 'oooh, that's cool', or 'ah, thats just what I need, that suits my need' at the other. We translate client experience into minute voltages which we encode and launch onto a network. We all need at least a basic understanding of the whole process. There's no reason to abandon the concept of the all-rounder who calls on non-all-rounders to knock out specialist sections of this process.
- hektor9110
what to print? hahahaha kidding!
- georgesIII0
Another thread about this? there are like 3 other threads about this very same thing...
I don't see Flash going away soon, but I like that at least for video people are starting to use standard based solutions (HTML5).
- mg330
One of my coworkers forwarded the story to our project manager and web strategy teams telling everyone that Adobe was abandoning Flash altogether! :D
- hah! the wizardry of people who spend all day in meetings astounds me sometimes....vaxorcist
- people only read titlesmanonthestreet
- That's why they're called "Top Line People"vaxorcist
- deathboy0
Im curious how many people really surf the internet on their mobile devices. More specifically phones. Aren't apps the easier thing to use?
I think it was wise of them to focus on the app market. The percentage of mobile users surfing random shit and needing flash probably doesnt justify the expense to support those few users. Be nice if they did but makes sense. As far as the whole OMG! flash on web is dead i find that hard to swallow. Take for example banners. How much easyier is it to animate a banner or simple tasks in flash than javascript. For the short term i still see flash being fine. If adobe creates GUI that is easy to use without scripting knowledge to animate i think that app would replace flash, but not actionscript and AIR stuff. Unless that app develops overtime and can become better than those technologies. I do like that flash had a contained environment that made things work pretty evenly seemlessly. You think apple would appreciate that fact since that is what they sell. As far as power usages its about how things are built not the tool used. And as far as motion it seemed at a higher level than alot of the html5 stuff, but again could be the builder and not the tools, however a lot of better builders in flash it seems. If flash said fuck u world and stopped who could animate a banner? I think of that when looking at this argument. Remember getting into this field in like 03-04. Saw some cool js animated banners. But it was niche and probably wasnt worth the costs. The flash GUI opened doors for mor epoeple to easily create small animation stuff in a confined environment. Until adobe creates something better for that stuff i think flash is fine. But i am interested in seeing if they can produce something a GUI for this newer stuff that surpasses the old. And hopefully we dont take a step back because a popular icon demonized something for his own gains.
- ESKEMA0
Flash simply was never ready for mobile. The security issues alone are a mindfuck. They tried but failed.
Adobe wants money too, it's not just Apple. They don't give a fuck about your creativity and freedom and pushing boundaries, they're a corporation and they're init for the money. HTML5 is where it's at now. They already have a bunch of software related to HTML5 deployment in the oven and they want you to buy it.
And for everyone always arguing with the App Store threat, that's just bullshit. HTML5 apps are just as threatening to the app Store as Flash was, it's simply not proprietary.- <monospaced
- indeedgeorgesIII
- so you're saying apple didn't make a brilliant business decision by not including flash on the iPhone?kingsteven
- i'd say it was definitely for all sorts of reasons, and to put it down to HTML5's superiority is a bit odd considering...kingsteven
- ... webGL, isn't in mobile safari yet... and this was two years ago?kingsteven
- Adobe didn't have a working product by then, and continually delayed it. At some point Apple said Fuck it...ESKEMA
- (and i think) at the minute WebGL works in iAds, but not within mobile safari?kingsteven
- exactly, so why do people always seem to make this a html5 vs flash thing?kingsteven
- the HTML5 always come because it's the alternative. People will always take sides when there are competing...ESKEMA
- products.ESKEMA
- btw, i didn't mean to imply that was your stance esk - but i think the 'threat' is viable, as one of many factors.kingsteven
- i'd see it more as a good way to build the market for apps, than a direct threat though.kingsteven
- sure, and it probably was too. That's just not the biggest reason as I see it...ESKEMA
- people made it html5 vs flash because thats what jobs made it... muppets - do you not remember his rantfadein11
- inteliboy0
wait until boz gets a load of this
- lolmonNom
- didn't Boz die? I've not seen an Android thread in a long timeomg
- he threatened to kill someone on the internetmonospaced
- GeorgesII0
what I see, everytime a wired/endgadget/gizmodo?? writer gets to include S.Jobs name in a article,
I can picture them yelling "FIRST"
then
- I could watch that for ages, even though I'm not gay.Ianbolton
- It's going to take ages for him to finish at that rate. Have fun!soundsinsilence
- Ianbolton0
what does this mean for digital media (ie turning pages) on mobile devices though? Does that mean everything will eventually be integrated into some kind of html5 format?
- lol @ "ie turning pages"kingsteven
- Tell me about it. For some reason my boss reckons it's The Future!Ianbolton
- CyBrainX0
How many HTML5 apps do you see out there compared to Flash content on the desktop web? How easy is it to create those HTML5 apps? How many people know how to do it? Given the numbers, do you really think it's a coincidence that Apple was the only major player to take the anti-Flash stance?
- Microsoft took the same stance, and Google just doesn't give a fuck because they license Android with or without Flash.ESKEMA
- animatedgif0
Suddenly everyone changes their tune and it was crap from the start anyway when a few months ago everyone was moaning because they couldn't get "the full internet" on phones and tablets.
Good thing no one important bet on that horse
- GeorgesII0
I think it's pitiful, that Adobe does this,
when flash works flawlessly on android and webos devices,Steve jobs was a big bully, who only went after flash because it would cut some profit from his cash cow >>> Appstore <<<
- that's pretty narrow-minded, he gave damn good reasons why he wouldn't support flashmonospaced
- Sorry, I have to agree 100% with GeorgesII on this one.CyBrainX
- you're blaming ONE company for killing the technology? That's basically Apple fanboy talk right theremonospaced
- Yup, I agree. Pure business move that worked very well. Shrewd business man, Jobs was.formed
- have to agree with George on this one - that article is bullshit as flash works fine on my mobile devicesfadein11
- It was a business move. That one business is responsible for the cream of the crop mobile devices. All others are seeking to imitate.instrmntl
- im with Georges on this one too, jobs designed a car that cant climb a hill, so he blames and takes out all the hillsmoldero
- So you all have had great experiences with Flash on a mobile device then? Did you read the article?soundsinsilence
- employee0
Actually there are a great deal of hosted app frameworks that will soon be out: brightcove has one, amazon will have one...
A full service authoring tool and wrapper that is hosted that takes you from creating, to submitting, to upgrading your app.
- yes... and a re-usable platform-independant wrapper would be good, less vendor lock-invaxorcist
- Ianbolton0
I think Adobe are minted enough as a business, a bit like Apple, so I can't really take sides with either. Not sure I'd call Apple a bully. I'm sure they're as bad as each other
- GeorgesII0
the bozman, always right on target,
i miss him
- He's a delusional Adobe shill who works in an unloved segment of a dull industry that should never have existed.detritus
- are you stupid detritus, seriously, your whole comment reeks of delusion, flash did a lot more to bring the web where it's at right now than apple ever didGeorgesII
- now,
than apple ever did with their closed systemsGeorgesII - "unloved segment of a dull industry that should never have existed" < Sums it up perfectlyanimatedgif
- you kids need educating as to how many of the 'concepts' you take for granted, we're originally driven by flash technologykingsteven
- 'never should have existed' is probably the most short sited bs i've read on here for a long while...kingsteven
- & Boz has been coding HTML5 technologies before you ever knew (and perhaps you still don't) what they were.kingsteven
- he is a total adobe fanboy but it's easy enough to filter past that to see he's usually right.kingsteven
- right? he makes some of the most hot-headed stupid predictions imaginablemonospaced
- that's Boz... but he has a much better grasp on the realities of technology outside of the normal open source vs propriety mentality...kingsteven
- so he tends to just defend adobe against this ridiculous ifabricated flash vs html5 argument.kingsteven
- which has everything to do with flash vs apps/ other proprietary technologies, and very little to do with open standards.kingsteven
- what happened to good ol boz anyway?moldero
- He ran away.antagonista
- It's funny you guys act like he knows something when he has never accomplished anything.antagonista
- mikotondria30
Clients want things that look like they have blending modes, motion blurs, 3d, scripted movements and interactions and animations that are frame/keyframe based. Who wouldn't leap at the chance of having AE-style mograph-looking output natively and at low cost running in the browser/app/interface window with high-level scripted interaction/augmented reality ?
We'd love it, our clients would love it. They'd pay us for it.
It would turn and generate billions of dollars, yet we're all stymied by trying to navigate this mountain in the mist and just shouting at each other on other paths. We thought we'd really taken a huge step up with Flash and for a while it was peachy, it was easy to produce impacting sites that clients and customers loved, but time moved on and the technology and the creativeware got out of sync.
Personally, I don't really give a crap about who wins in the deployment layer, I like to code, script, design and animate to interpret my clients' vision and precisely deliver their brand and product - I want to be able to do that with high-level tools that really work and that can produce output that is easily adaptable to the display device, looking spectacular on cinema displays and smoothly functional on a lower-grade Android.
Whoever delivers that will get my money and my loyalty, I don't care who they are. For an industry as a whole to have dropped the ball on not delivering a killer product to as an enormous and sophisticated and wealthy marketplace as the 10s of millions of designers and developers is shocking, I can't think of any other that has performed so badly and become such a mired clusterfuck as this.- hahaha, some good pointsukit2
- There's just so much hot air. Our job is to make great stuff for clients, that their customers love. We're b2b. This is just bs.mikotondria3
- by time do u mean public opinion? take flash out and what do u have for animated web based stuff?deathboy
- As far as best tools still seems like flash takes the cake.deathboy
- or is that what youre saying?deathboy
- well yes and no, I always had trouble with glitches in the editor, and with the performance issues on so many platforms and the fact it was a plugin...mikotondria3
- and the Jobs' opinion has flitered down to clients who want something else. They know that and they want more seo, yeesh.mikotondria3
- clients are idiots.. but youre right. they think somethign is better because there is buzz about itdeathboy
- few realize what it is and how it relates to them. friggen clients. im interested in seeing what adobe does still think it smart to pull resourcesdeathboy
- pull resources since apps the way to go mobile it seems. AS was an advanced js in closed environment w/ gui. Maybe flash will just adapt open environment js stuffdeathboy
- flash will jsut adapt js open environment stuff. I jsut dont want to back track to pre flash daysdeathboy
- Right, that's a great point. AS is just a flavor of JS,..mikotondria3