Winning the jobs
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- Sifcri
In a market where, all we know, there are many design companies and studios (bad and good), where you have to compete with people that just because they know how to use Photoshop they think to be graphic designers, which are the "secrets" to winning the good jobs? Good clients list? Good portfolio? Price? How smart you are? Must be politically involved? (here is 70%!) A good sales manager?
We recently lost a very nice project (website) for one of the biggest and most important car dealers (they are the official dealer of the famous italian red car ..) in our city. Well .. our competitor asked less than 1500 Euros for making the website ..
And i'm not angry with my competitor (ok .. for me they are not a real competitor) but with the client who does not understand a fuc.... shi ..... (and we spent many hours try to educate them that building a website is not so easy and cheap as they think).
- breadlegz0
People buy from people they like.
People like people like themselves.
Therefore...
People buy from people like themselves.
I've found this is a key desicion making principle from teh client waaaaay before they look at your skills etc...
- ********0
Do good work.
Make sure you're in a supply chain.
- breadlegz0
Make sure you're in a supply chain. ??
- ********0
I'm mad as hell at an agency I work for, they always way over charge/quote! A pitch we (i) just did for a massive (awesome portfolio) client, just fell through because we charged like twice as much as any other agency!! But the client actually said "it's a shame cos your design pitch was by far the best"
...arrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrgh!!! :(
- Redmond0
It's not always about doing good work, It's about supplying what the client wants. So I would never say someone else's work sucks. I'd just convince the client that I'm exactly what they are looking for.
- k0na_an0k0
The more gold chains you wear the more people will trust you.
This works especially well with used car salesman.
Elvis glasses are an added touch of style and class.
I've been using this method for years with great results.
*picks teeth with toothpick
- momento0
It is enough to make one give up. I spend most of my days going through similar issues. i spent the start of January thinking about what I would do if I weren't a designer. Until I have created that time machineI decided to shut up, get on with it and try, wherever possible, to make the world a better place.
First stop: not working with people who do not value me or my ten years of experience. If that ends up with me and no clients, then it was meant to be.I once won a pitch for a web site for a large UK music magazine only to have the client call the next day and say'actually, really sorry, but 'X' company came back and said they would do it for FREE.'
For FREE!!! Karma worked its way around and the amg went tits up four months later so alls well that ends well.
Peas out.
- HelixDnB0
"I'm mad as hell at an agency I work for, they always way over charge/quote! A pitch we (i) just did for a massive (awesome portfolio) client, just fell through because we charged like twice as much as any other agency!! But the client actually said "it's a shame cos your design pitch was by far the best"
...arrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr rrrgh!!! :(
RoomFive
(Jan 22 07, 07:06)"If this is the case then the presenting team that you have and other teams that you have working on the presentations aren't doing a good enough job of conveying WHY your work costs the # that it does compared to the competition. Unless you can sway this fact you're going to have a hard time dealing with getting new clients on board for new work. Not only that but you must have the track record behind you and your work in order to be asking for $X.
- ********0
I agree with all that HelixDnB. I don't like my job there (only 3 days a week though), sometimes it's like banging my head on a brick wall. I can only do so much! They have the portfolio, client list and all that, but they just charge too much, and I think it's how they approach it aswel sometimes... but I'm just a stupid kid to them, so what do I know :/ grrr
- breadlegz0
RoomFive:
If they are getting the work in, then they are not charging too much.Also, how you do define too much?
If a client pays 10k for a site and they get 10 orders of 1k in the first month its a cheap site. If they get 1 order in 10 months its a very expensive site...
- ********0
Put it this way...
They charge like £175 for 30 second simple text amends I do to existing sites.
And that pitch they lost... I looked at the proposal before they sent it, and it was already £14k, but I noticed they'd forgotten to include ONE simple text only page (like a contact page for instance), and they said "oh yeah well spotted, better quote the £18.5k instead"
!!! wtf !!!
- Mick0
The winners are not the best agencies or designers with the best solutions.
The winners are those that can sell their idea well (and read the client well to know what they want) and in many cases convince them what they want.
Learn who your clients decision makers are and find out what their goal is. E.g. If your client has an overpowering creative lead that has a strong voice, pitch with design in mine. If your client has a sales/producer that is a team leader, make sure you have good value.
- Sifcri0
But what about when the client don't understand the difference between good design and bad design? I think it's a cultural problem. Most of the time i don't have a brand manager or a marketing director in front of me, especially if the client is a mid-sized company. Most of the time i talk directly to the owner of the company who think that making a logo or a website must cost 1000 $ ... (the same price he spent 20 years ago) It's very frustrating sometimes because you spend most of the time tin educating them on the value of your job, the quality of your work , the benefits of good design, ... and what happens? You lose just because of the price or because his son can do the same job using photoshop... I think that this is the foundation why we see so bad design .... Or am i wrong?
- ********0
But what about when the client don't understand the difference between good design and bad design?
SifcriBingo! I come across that problem ALL the time! I always hear, "well this guy said he'd do it £200" and I just wanna say "yeah well that guy can't design to save his f*****g life!"
- breadlegz0
when it comes to cost there are billions of web designers doing sites for 100 quid or less..
When a client tells us this we laugh and say "please use them then"... then we usually find they say "ahem.. cough.. we wouldnt use a company like that .. we were just saying ... cough"
- OSFA0
Client: Well this guy said he could do it for......
Designer: Really? that's great my little sister needs a cheap web design like those for her sleepover planner. She's 9 and i think she could really use this guy. Have a nice day!
- ETM0
You can't get them all.
Know your worth.
Stand your ground.
Treat your good clients like gold.
Don't be afraid to "fire" your bad clients.
It all falls into place.
- OSFA0
amen!
- Complexfruit0
Somewhat related to what everyone has been saying:
http://newyork.craigslist.org/mn…
Synopsis:
Listing tells everyone seeking creatives on CL not to be cheap and insulting when it comes to compensation.
- material-10
i guess I'm losing. super slammed but someone called for a proposal. Doubled my rate but kept the hours realistic. Haven't heard back.