Your beliefs?
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- _smk0
that wasn't in relation to you flying Steve ;)
- discipler0
_smk, no question that its a hard pill to swallow, that we're bankrupt in our sin without Christ. Best to you as well. :)
- jakeyj0
remember that 10 commandments thread?
just goes to show that everyone breaks the commandments so we're all in the same boat. that's what it means that we're all born into sin.
christianity was never meant to be a religion. as a religion, just look at world history and see how many people have used and abused it.
christianity is about relationships. that's it.
- unfittoprint0
an awakening to ancient european paganism.
that my friends, is a beautiful thing.
- discipler0
well put, jake.
The whole reason for the 10 commandments was to show us that we cannot meet God's perfect standard. Enter: Christ.
# Romans 8:2-4
"because through Christ Jesus the law of the Spirit of life set me free from the law of sin and death. For what the law was powerless to do in that it was weakened by the sinful nature, God did by sending his own Son in the likeness of sinful man to be a sin offering. And so he condemned sin in sinful man, in order that the righteous requirements of the law might be fully met in us, who do not live according to the sinful nature but according to the Spirit."
- _smk0
I'm quite partial to sun and moon worship actualy :) the ancients had it right I say, a more naturaly balanced belief system imo
obviously apart from all the virgin sacrificing and blood drinking and all that gooey stuff ;)
- Kuz0
hold up. I mean the love of God when i'm deeed. (dead)
You say that that's like the gift innit? Bein next to da daddy. So what, me afterlife is gonna be me sitting back and thinking - ooh i love being loved unconditionally!
Pretty fuckin needy aren't we? What a pathetic race. You should read some psychoanalytical stuff, and hear what Freud and Jung have to say about that.
I was in a catholic church one time, checkin it out. Saw all these people with their heads bowed, praying and crying towards the altar looking up at Christo. And I thought, children. They looked like children, these middle aged old folk. And then I got it. The whole damn thing. Cos when you’re born like, it’s your parental love, unconditional parental love that makes you want to live. It validates your existence – and if you don’t get it, you become a very unhinged individual. Being cuddled and loved, kiddies yearn for that affection. And then we lose it as our parents frustrate us and then we spend the rest of our lives looking for it, in our friends and our sexual liaisons. Makes us feel validated. And then these Christians took all those feelings and expressed it to the person of Christ, and be like “Christ cares!, he loves me no matter what!” God the father, the desire for paternalism our driving force that keeps us out of manic depression. It is so easy to play on that emotion. Especially as people get older, their parents and other loved ones start dying. That’s why they pray so much. Kinda momentary schizophrenia, as though someone is actually listening – and then there’s that image of sacrifice on the cross staring at you – the pure agony. It’s like “oh yes! You did that for me?? I’m not worthy of your love!”. A religion that totally plays on peoples emotions...
- paraselene0
ooh. smk, remind me to tell you about my voodoo caribbean virgin sacrifice experience at the next nt london drinkup you attend.
- _smk0
Fuck! I may even attend one just for that :P
Did you drink 'er blood? did you?
- Kuz0
hold up again
i ain't born in sin. How am i born in sin? what the fuck did i do?
- unfittoprint0
Sintra, Chartres, Tomar.
not the roman fairytale of the bearded one.
- jakeyj0
yeah christians have totally lost appreciation for the environment. good point smk.
kuz - good point too. interesting theory. but what about people who are religious how grew up with loving parents. grew up with abuse?
love is realizing something outside yourself exists.
- chossy0
*holds hand up to shush the crowd, I will accept all youse guys and dolls into chosstopia and so youse all came to chosstopia and things became very groovy for all youse. Cause in chosstopia everyone is fully rad and bad stuff doesn't happen only cool stuff like meatball sandwiches and jumping into streams naked before the free sex love.
- discipler0
The Bible teaches that Christians will ultimately be on a restored earth. Essentially heaven and earth becoming one, with Christ as the central figure, to be worshipped as we live in harmony with one another and without the corruptive power of sin. But Eschatology is another discussion in itself. So, it won't be "sitting back etc...".
I don't know about your experience in that Catholic church. I don't ascribe to very much of what the Catholic church teaches and it is my belief that the majority of Catholics have not received the gift of Christ because of the emphasis on performance-based religion.
As for your point about us being needy... we are. I believe we are born with a longing for fellowship with our creator. I suppose you could choose to see it as some manipulative play on people's emotions and no doubt "religion" is just that. It just makes more sense to me that we are simply a people who long for a relationship with God, but who often try to substitute that relationship with temporal things that do not last and do not satisfy. :)
- emecks0
*holds hand up to shush the crowd, I will accept all youse guys and dolls into chosstopia and so youse all came to chosstopia and things became very groovy for all youse. Cause in chosstopia everyone is fully rad and bad stuff doesn't happen only cool stuff like meatball sandwiches and jumping into streams naked before the free sex love.
chossy
(Apr 20 05, 06:44)sounds like someone has had a shower at last ;)
- _smk0
*where's my pen, I'm signing up...
Is this all happening at your new gaff Chossy? whats the rege fee?
- jakeyj0
kuz - to explain what it means to be born into sin we'd first have to agree what sin is and that there actually is sin.
so for sin's like i said before: know what you should do and not doing it.
like if you see someone on the side of road needing help and you don't stop. that's sin i think. do you agree?
- discipler0
kuz, the Bible teaches that we are all born into sin because of the original fall of man/woman. So, we inherit this fallen nature. Almost like an inherited blood disease. It teaches that we are sinners by both nature and behavior and are therefore born physically alive, but spiritually dead (seperated). This is why Christ said (to a very religious man) "you must be born again." Born of the Spirit. (See John Ch. 3)
- GeorgiePorgie0
Jesus declared, “I tell you the truth, no one can see the kingdom of God unless he is born again.”
John 3:3
- Kuz0
My experience in the catholic church could apply to anyone praying - even my mother praying with tears in her eyes to Allah.
I do not think we are born with a longing for relationship with God. I think we are born with a longing to be loved. But life is difficult and it's a cold and indifferent universe - and people will consistently let you down. And that psychological disconnection, especially in Capitalisms alienation abliity, leads to the idea of providence. Which is universal and exists since long long time ago. The figure of Christ on the cross and some forms of evangelical Christianity fits that need so perfectly. But that is all it is, a need fulfilled by imagery.