Death of Flash
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- GeorgesII0
Apple user 10% of PC on the planet,
iphone shares is growing but its just a phone dammit,
but do you really think the rest of the world will stop using flash because steve Jobs said it and it can't run on the Iphone and Ipad,
ffs get your shit together Apple users- no one said that. Get back to work, stop venting. lol********
- lol, sorry, had to do a freakin site in flash in about 4 hours, I'm pissed ehehheGeorgesII
- no one said that. Get back to work, stop venting. lol
- twokids0
the ipad could lead to the end of apple as we know them. they may become a niche player over this issue. They have walked this tightrope of being proprietary and yet appearing to support the open source mentality for many years. the ipad could be their undoing over the lack of support for flash and java. two interesting reads below.
- rounce0
This thread has a signal/noise ratio of almost nought.
I gave up before the end of the first page and, I'm only sticking around for the image posts.
- ESKEMA0
^^no flash here. I'm not saying that flash is dead, but it won't be the only option. Flash is what it is now because there was never an alternative.
- i agree with that. it is not healthy for one software to dominate. so apple and flash are kind of similar, in a way.twokids
- this doesn't work in IE, and that is why we have flashMilan
- Adobe 'had' Live Motion before it was Adobe Flash. Microsoft has Silverlight.fyoucher1
- witch are all proprietary too. I was meaning no proprietary alternative.ESKEMA
- Pixter0
Java is not dead
- GeorgesII0
Anyone got a good Director tutorial??
- eieio0
ipad doesn't have flash because apple is creating and protecting another platform for this lucrative mac app industry that has popped up. can't really have that if flash is all go. there's nothing inherently bad about flash and its not going anywhere but the personal computing world is definitely being divided up.
- twokids0
...and if you are a company that is revered by artists and alternative types as the embodiment of the creative process, and many of those types are also open source advocates, you have a problem by saying:
"here's a sexy platform i made but you can't view or use critical tools used to create content"
and there sits google
- raf0
There was lots of talking about how iPhone's lack of Flash was going to suck. This came only from people who never owned an iPhone and did not stop millions from getting at least one each.
I own one (two and an iPod Touch actually) and as much as I love Flash, I never found the iPhone lacking support for it to be a problem.
I'm not a prophet, but I feel that Flash, the better player (pun intended), is going away the way of Betamax.
HTML5 is here and it can do half of the things Flash could do in 1999. It's laughable compared to modern Flash, but something tells me it will win.
- Would you also bet on an image editor that was about as good as Photoshop 5?CyBrain
- twokids0
yeah, but that is a phone, where the internet stuff was new and so people accepted the limitations, since it was so cool that you could just do that.
and for an ipad, with which you are supposed to be able to 'hold the internet in your hands' (except of course for flash and java)
It is interesting that they show the NYTimes on the ipad (Jobs on stage) as an example. How will you view those cool multimedia interactive graphics they do at the NY Times using Flash? whoops! can't.if you have a situation where you can choose between a google product that is truly open source, runs flash, java, etc...and apple, which is proprietary, well, i think apple will lose a lot of people, and over time, a lot more.
there is a reason that Apple has 10% market share of computers, where for a time in the 80s they were a serious player vs. intel/microsoft. that same mentality.
- must_dash0
flash doesn't work with the interaction model of the iphone or ipad... even some apps like the html5 paint program doesn't work, as you can't draw, as when you try to it just drags the screen around...
quess they'll need to play around with resize and viewport etc
- rounce0
mr. twokids, I wouldn't say they're 'right' but they're not 'wrong' either. The SWF format specification IS open source, and they already have x264 licenced so _in_theory_ they could write their own flash player and take advantage of OpenGL at the same time and give their uses a better experience for flash content. Though they could have done this for years now and they haven't likely as it'd be a hefty undertaking - but not THAT much of a problem for a company the size of Apple. With renewed interest in Safari as a product to be taken seriously, and their enthusiasm for the richer content possibilities of HTML5 and not having to go to the trouble and cost of licencing Flash from Adobe.
It's of my opinion that Apple don't see the point of supporting Flash on the iPad & iPhone, simply because they don't have very much to gain from any eventuality compared to Adobe. Consider their two main options:
* Apple licence a version of Flash Player direct from Adobe for their devices: Apple effectively hand Adobe greater product penetration, gives them a greater market presence, and slips em an exorbitant amount of cash.
* Apple write their own FP implementation: Apple gets product control, but only to a degree, they're still playing catch-up every time Adobe makes a change to the spec. They'll also end up spending a lot on the project which, don't forget, will most likely have teething troubles so it'd still be pretty far off.All for what? To stop their users moaning about Flash support and start moaning about something less superficial? Forget it.
Helping to push HTML5 is a far better option for Apple as it's something they already support. If the HTML5 dream doesn't die after all the current buzz has died down, then less people will mind not having Flash content so much, as most of the things they want to do (Watch videos, listen to music, etc) will be possible.
That's not to say that Flash will be pushed to the sidelines. It will still have it's place on the web, as well as for devices such as set top boxes, just maybe not so much for internet video delivery. It also means Adobe will have to freshen up Flash and get creative, which can't be a bad thing either.
As users and developers, we'll decide. The web is a place of constant user driven technological darwinism. On these issues we can only look to the future without prejudice, safe in the knowledge that whoever has made the wrong move has fucked themselves royally.
As for my day to day, personally I don't care, if people want fancy HTML5 shit zipping around the screen, fuck it, I'll charge them the same as I would to do it all in AS3. Just with a slightly different breakdown on the invoice.
- I can do both y'see ;)rounce
- so far we're only talking about apple, what other manufacturer will not support flash?? none I guess,GeorgesII
- We've also been discussing the impact that HTML5 could have on Flash. First half Apple, 2nd part impact of HTML5.rounce
- I tried to be concise, I could rattle about Flash Vs. The AppStore as well if you want?rounce
- fyoucher10
Flash not on the iPhone / iPad:
Here are my thoughts on that...
Apple just bought Quattro Wireless (mobile advertising). Currently, on the web, Flash Player is what is used to serve rich media ads. Whether it be video, those overlay ads you see, or little mini commercials made at 40k...99% of those ads are delivered in Flash, a piece of SOFTWARE made by Adobe. Software is where all of the money is at. Now if Adobe Flash Player could run on an iPhone or iPad, any company could make a iDevice compatible site and run ads made from Flash to generate revenue. Maybe Apple wants a piece of that. Maybe their making their own proprietary software to deliver ads specifically on their devices. In a few years, just about everyone will have an iPhone or iPad (well, that's what Apple is banking on). That'll open up a new area in advertising and advertising is BIG money. Move on over Adobe. Apple controls what goes on their devices. They want a lil' piece of that Flash action.
