John Kerry
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- Balance0
The thread title just called and asked for it's topic back.
- flagellum0
Telling quotes from some founding fathers:
- mpfree0
A nun is undressing for a bath and while she's standing naked
there's a knock at the door.The nun calls: "Who is it?"
a voice answers: "A blind man".The nun decides to get a thrill by having the blind man in
the room while she's naked so she lets him in.The man walks in, looks straight at the nun and says:
"Corrrrrrrrrrrr, and can I sell you a blind dearie...?"
- mpfree0
Sister Catherine is asking all the Catholic school children in fourth grade what they want to be when they grow up. Little Sheila says: "When I grow up, I want to be a prostitute!" Sister Catherine's eyes grow wide and she barks: "What the (beeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeb) did you say?" "A prostitute!" Sheila repeats. Sister Catherine breathes a sight of relief and says: "Thank God! I thought you said a Protestant"
- flagellum0
Mimio: Tell me what you are going to do with the David Berlinskis, Anthony Flews, Michael Dentons and scores of other ID proponents who are either agnostic, Jewish, Muslim, Deist, etc...?
Nice try.
- Mimio0
Pony, I'm not telling anyone how to vote. I saying it's not rational to make it your agenda to legislate any form of superstitious morality. It doesn't preserve the rights of other citizens who don't share those superstitions.
- flagellum0
Berlinski is one of the most outspoken and prolific ID proponents and he's an agnostic.
- flagellum0
Define "supersitious morality", Mimio. Then provide a cogent argument for how there can be morals, in principle, without an absolute standard to establish them.
- Mimio0
Discipler, It's doesn't matter what flavor of Theist they are, the ID movement was clearly spearheaded by the American Religious Right. Shall I name Discovery Insitute's founders and their other associations again?
- TheBlueOne0
Let me count the times that I, an agnostic, have walked into a church and criticized beliefs or practices:
0
ANd the times I have told christians that they can't or shouldn't practice their religion in the good old US of A:
0
The blood I would give to allow any person in the US of A the right to freely worship the divine in the way they see fit:
All of it.
Number of times evangelicals have told me I was going to hell but Jesus loved me anyway:
6
How many times "christians" push their moral agenda on me in public and interfere with the government via faith based initiatives:
Do the math.
- flagellum0
Mimio: Nonsense.
Hard to tell whether you're just ingorant or lying. (and agnostics can't be considered theists). The ID movement has it's origins with the collection of data over the past 50 years. Starting with Watson and Crick's discovery of the double-helix. Shall I name again all the pro-ID organizations which have no affiliation with Discovery Institute? Shall I name the ID proponents who are not fellows of any organization?
- Mimio0
Superstitious morality for example is thinking homosexuality is evil and wrong and punishable by perpetual torment in hell via "Divine Justice".
Real morals are relative, They're based on the relationship of personal freedoms and preserving the health of society at large.
- PonyBoy0
Pony, I'm not telling anyone how to vote. I saying it's not rational to make it your agenda to legislate any form of superstitious morality. It doesn't preserve the rights of other citizens who don't share those superstitions.
Mimio
(Nov 1 06, 12:51)
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What gives you the right to call his/her beliefs 'superstitions'?You've missed my point completely -
... you believe religious people are trying to run on their 'superstitions' - but in regards to those on the other side - It's 'real' to them... which is why they fight for it.
You don't see it as 'real'... therefor you think it should have no part of the 'discussion'...
... but, religion is very 'real' in the minds of many - which the left is VERY disrespectful of...
... as you just sort of showed us, Mimio... by using the term 'superstition' as apposed to 'belief'.
- ********0
amen Blue
- Mimio0
Pony, It's my BELIEF that most religious people are delusional and irrational. How's that sound? any better? It's also my belief to refrain from showing respect to any supernatural beliefs.
- jevad0
Let me count the times that I, an agnostic, have walked into a church and criticized beliefs or practices:
0
ANd the times I have told christians that they can't or shouldn't practice their religion in the good old US of A:
0
The blood I would give to allow any person in the US of A the right to freely worship the divine in the way they see fit:
All of it.
Number of times evangelicals have told me I was going to hell but Jesus loved me anyway:
6
How many times "christians" push their moral agenda on me in public and interfere with the government via faith based initiatives:
Do the math.
TheBlueOne
(Nov 1 06, 12:55)thank you.
- Mimio0
Flagellum, How and I "ingorant" as you put it? Am I to believe that the ID movement isn't religous in origins and in it's support?
- flagellum0
Mimio: I know of no one who holds to your definition of "superstitious morality". Sounds like it was made up of whole cloth. And based on some sort of unwarranted caricature.
Now what if, as history has demonstrated, that a goverment decides that preserving the health of society at large means exterminating part of the population? This ok right, because it's all relative? If it's wrong, explain why it's wrong, in principle.
- flagellum0
Flagellum, How and I "ingorant" as you put it? Am I to believe that the ID movement isn't religous in origins and in it's support?
Mimio
(Nov 1 06, 13:03)ummm, because that assertion is completely false? Yes, that's why.
- TheBlueOne0
What government did Jesus advocate voting for? I remember him rejecting the whole political kit and kaboodle in the desert as one of Satan's temptations. Why oh why can't his followers live up to his message?
"When Satan offers Jesus the kingdoms of the earth, it is not merely to hand over a set of keys. He is tempting Jesus into undertaking the path of the State, the path of violence and domination and hierarchy which is necessary to the functioning and control of a State. He is trying to goad the sinless one onto performing those "necessary evils" (or shall we call them "necessary sins"?) which bring order out of chaos... Not realizing that the problem of the universe is not order vs. chaos, but moral vs. immoral, right vs. wrong."
Luke 4:14-21:
""THE SPIRIT OF THE LORD IS UPON ME,
BECAUSE HE ANOINTED ME TO PREACH THE GOSPEL TO THE POOR.
HE HAS SENT ME TO PROCLAIM RELEASE TO THE CAPTIVES,
AND RECOVERY OF SIGHT TO THE BLIND,
TO SET FREE THOSE WHO ARE OPPRESSED,
TO PROCLAIM THE FAVORABLE YEAR OF THE LORD."Lots of stuff there about how to fight oppression and side with the poor, not so much about running governments and dominating foreign lands.
Sorry, I just see the whole political evangelical thing as Christianity for Dummies and no different than any other religion in history. It had a shot at escaping that cycle, but they blow it again.