gay anti gay?
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- Mal0
- bitPic0
Hot Girl on Hot Girl makes sense to me
- monospaced0
I am beyond disappointed in certain QBNers, based on their posts here. This is a sad day or realization. I'm sad and mad.
- dittoscarabin
- I won't name names, but it hurts to know that people truly fall for the God bullshitmonospaced
- this thread must have started in the Victorian eraMal
- Why does it hurt, monospaced? Have I done something to offend you?gramme
- It amazes me how upset people get when I don't buy a party line of the decade.gramme
- yeah, your point of view has seriously disappointed me grammemonospaced
- because you are buying the party line of the milleniummonospaced
- You're right Mal, because human beings have of course fundamentally changed in drastic ways since Queen Victoria.gramme
- Victoria.gramme
- Because you are pulling the cart for something we see as fundamentally wrong. Gay people are real.DrBombay
- Well, faith seemed absurd to me too before I believed. That's how it goes.gramme
- Do you make a decision every morning to not be gay?DrBombay
- Dr. B, I never said they weren't real people. Go back and read my last (long) post.gramme
- You must because it is a choice, apparently. Have you made the wrong choice in the past? Been tempted?DrBombay
- Now you're just trying to piss me off. Haven't you tried and failed before?gramme
- I've been tempted to do all sorts of wrong in the past, and I've given in many times. That's what forgiveness is for.gramme
- Have you been tempted to have gay sex before?DrBombay
- But no, being gay is not something I struggle with. I've got plenty of other issues.gramme
- Gayness not being real and just a temptation people give into...DrBombay
- How do you know it isn't real?DrBombay
- Unless you have first hand knowledge of the temptation you deem it to be?DrBombay
- bitPic0
I heard the nazi's had a program to turn people gay from a young age.
More kids with no parents are adopted and taken care of cause of Gay people.
- gramme0
Lukus: you know what I'm about to say, but here it is: sometimes people are changed, not by peer pressure but by God.
Balk, yell, deride, throw stuff, whatever—it happens once in a blue moon, and those men and women have reported subsequent contentment despite their struggles.
I know I know, "why try to change something that wasn't wrong to begin with." That takes us right back to the original point of tension, and I don't think we're going to change each others minds on the subject. Nevertheless: I don't know about you, but I enjoy these sorts of discussions, even if agreement never happens. At the very least, perhaps we're pushed into reflecting more seriously about what we believe, and I think that's worth something. I hope we can all have a huge bromantic getaway in Napa when this wraps up.
- Despite the fact that monospaced is eternally woundedgramme
- no, just severely disappointedmonospaced
- This can't all be news to you, bud. And despite our differences, I still respect yougramme
- for whatever it's worth.gramme
- dittomonospaced
- lukus_W0
@gramme;
Well, I'm not the yelling type. As I said before, I wasn't expecting to change your mind. I can imagine it might be very difficult for you to believe otherwise.
I will say this; it's depressing to think that there are people who are holding out for a 'miracle' like that, and it's equally as depressing that there are people who are willing to suggest that such a 'miracle' exists.
I'd love to be able to believe in God - but it's ideas like this that really turn me off Christianity.
- Hey don't believe me, believe the people who claim their lives have been changed.gramme
- When it rains, for all I know - it could be god's tears. If a gay man wakes up and gets a woody - it could be god too...lukus_W
- (*gets a woody when he sees boobs)lukus_W
- Christians do not own the conept of sprituality. Billions of peoples lives have been changed by Buddha.DrBombay
- The fact that people may feel they've been fixed by God, doesn't change the fact I find the phenomenon depressing.lukus_W
- gramme0
Well, I'm truly sorry to hear you say that lukus, but I'll say what I once heard from a kind pastor who's wiser than me: everyone is welcome in the church. No one is welcome to stay as they are. The reason is because God wants us to enjoy him, and he knows what we truly need in life.
Lastly, I hope this resonates in some way, shape or form (from the Westminster Catechism, emphasis mine):
"The chief end of man is to glorify God BY enjoying him forever."—As opposed to simply following rules out of a misguided sense of duty. Because really, the only good reason for doing anything is love. Then of course we'll disagree until reaching the Restaurant at the End of the Universe about how to define REAL love...
- Where does the judgement of others come into play in the enjoyment of your God?DrBombay
- You're confusing a disagreement with someone's lifestyle choice and condemning someone.gramme
- And unless you haven't been reading, I'm indicting my own laundry list of faults here too.gramme
- I'm not above anyone.gramme
- Those are just words. Your opinion denies people the same treatment you enjoy.DrBombay
- *ahem* .. it's not a lifestyle choice.lukus_W
- This all requires the belief that God exists and has "spoken." There is no proof of it.monospaced
- DrBombay0
Another thing I never understood was why do Christians feel they own the idea of marriage to begin with? It has been around longer than Christianity. You own the concept no more than cavemen or a couple of gay dudes.
- silly, no such thing as cavemen. earth is just 7,000 years old.iCanHasQBN
- Mal0
I have never believed in God not even as a child. I don't have the need to answer any questions about why I'm here. My Father once said to me in my early teens "If you EVER pick on someone because of the color of skin, size, sex or sexuality you will have me to answer to".
I never did and without the need for religion I'm a pretty good person.- yay me.Mal
- Congratulations. But the point of my faith is not to become a pretty good person.gramme
- Because it takes more than being "pretty good," and none of us are good enough.gramme
- Thus the need for a savior.gramme
- "the need for a savior". such mind-numbingly retarded babble.iCanHasQBN
- I like who I am I have no guilt for anything I've done. Guilt is not in my vocabulary.Mal
- gramme have you time-traveled from the dark-ages?iCanHasQBN
- iCanHasQBN0
how can gramme not be gay.. when he's such a cock full of shit?
- Right, because that's a fair characterization.gramme
- im just playing dawg. you seem like a nice guy. you're just misguided thats all. just like us non-believers.iCanHasQBN
- lukus_W0
Well .. we all know where we stand. I think we should all agree to disagree.
- Yes, we should all let people like Gramme dictate who has less rights than him.DrBombay
- This is where I brofess my brodying brove for you, bro.gramme
- I've not said anything about people's rights, Dr. B.gramme
- You believe the gays shouldn't be allowed to marry, because christians own the concept of marriage.DrBombay
- Not in so many words but...DrBombay
- Mal0
- lukus_W0
I suppose it is difficult situation; how much credence should a religious principle like this be given?
Gramme; while you're willing to tolerate homosexuals as people who have chosen the wrong 'lifestyle choice' - there are other people who are far more fundamental in their beliefs. Some people actively hunt and and murder 'known homosexuals'. I'd imagine that the fundamentalists would agree with the basic tenets of your argument.
I don't like the idea of you being made a scape-goat, but because a continuum like this exists, perhaps it's morally correct for society to be intolerant of your views re. homosexuality?
After all, society doesn't accept people who are 'slightly racist'.
- gramme0
Well, such fundamentalist types are not actually practicing the "fundamentals" found in the Bible (the label of fundamentalism has taken only the sadly ironic meaning of a person who is actually anything but orthodox). There's no excuse for hunting or murdering anyone for any reason, ever.
I don't think it's sensible for society to be intolerant of my views, because I'm not explicitly or implicitly doing actual harm to a single person. That being said, I've long ceased to expect sense from society in general. And to paraphrase Jesus, resistance is to be expected. Now, if I was being a blatant asshole, that would be one thing. But I don't think that's the case here—that is, at least I've tried as always to be equitable and even-handed.
Comparing my views about sexuality with people who are "slightly racist" is insulting to me, but I can see how it might not be any different from your perspective.
- *has taken ongramme
- I didn't mean to insult - but I'm glad you can see how I could make the comparison.lukus_W
- I don't think you're a blatant asshole by any stretch .. but I do worry that measured arguments can be used by those who are 'blatant assholes' as validation for their own intolerant views.lukus_W
- those who are 'blatant assholes' as validation for their own intolerant views.lukus_W
- Ideas are contagious - it's all our duties to make sure our own ideas are worth catching ..lukus_W
- the bible literally tells us to murder and hurt people who go against the word of godscarabin
- No it doesn't, scarabin. You're confusing it with the Q'uran.gramme
- drgss0
next person to write a reply in this thread is gay
- JazX0
- monospaced0
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