Brendan Eich resigns as Mozilla CEO
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- CygnusZero40
how F is that equal rights? LGBT people arent exactly going around looking to deny others of rights that im aware of. you cannot be this dumb.
lmao personal beliefs. it is not right to deny one person the same rights others get to enjoy just because they were born differently. wake up. ur grandparents big slavery fans? its no different genius.
- denying a person their right to contribute to a political campaign on their choice?monNom
- ukit20
I don't think it's contradictory though to be intolerant of intolerant people. Do you think it's reasonable for a KKK member or a Holocaust denier or advocate of pedophilia being head of your company, of course not. I'm not saying his views are equivalent to that but the point is, tolerance is not absolute. So the question is where the line is drawn.
- i think it's reasonable for them to be a head of 'a' company. i wouldn't have elected them for mine, but that's just me.SteveJobs
- Well that's exactly the point, Mozilla decided it wasn't right for themukit2
- well, choosing whether to elect a ceo or whether to fire him for personal differences are two different things.SteveJobs
- one is innocent favoritism, the other is discrimination.SteveJobs
- CygnusZero40
no line is drawn. you shut up and let people live their lives they way they want. it is not right to deny gay people of marriage. im not gay but i am very aware of how horrible it is to tell them they just arent allowed. thats awful to treat people that way just because you dont like who theyre having sex with lmfao.
it doesnt really matter what some religion says about it, its a human rights issue and isnt fair. gay people arent denying anyone of any rights or attacking those that are different than them, are they? nope. its the closed minded fucks who are attacking people trying to deny them of the same rights they get to enjoy. there is a damn good reason why what he did is not sitting well with a shit ton of people. this kind of behavior is becoming completely unacceptable.
- SteveJobs0
alright, calm down. i don't want you getting an ulcer over this.
'equal rights' may be open to interpretation but i think it means we're all allowed to believe what we want and to express our beliefs freely.
what lgbt are doing in their free time is no concern of mine, not the issue and thusly a fallacy in your argument.
no it's not a right to deny someone rights, but Eich couldn't do that anyway as he wasn't given that power. what he was given, however was the right to vote. this is a constitutional right.
i'm awake
yes they might have been, i don't know, but wouldn't share their views if that were the case.
and yes, it's very different.
- ukit20
The funniest objection I've heard on this (not here but on other site) is social conservatives saying it's like thought crime and now they can all be fired for their belief which is unfair.
This in a country where gay people can still be fired for being gay in most states.
- and sue the living shit of the company, really ukit, you don't live is S.ArabiaGeorgesIV
- No, you really can be fired for being gay, and there's no Protected Status in many places. Wise up !
mikotondria3
- GeorgesIV0
ok, because we've def reached another level of crazy,
question for everyone,• do you believe in democracy?
• do you believe voting should be taken seriously?
• do you think when people vote and reject something that is contrary to your views, their votes should be revoked?
• do you believe in democracy?I can't believe you don't see it
I too can say the most extreme thing, if hitler was having pedophile relationship with an adopted blind kids, should he be able to run a company?
you still not see it? tell me it's starting to be clear in your mind where I'm going,
- women/religion/gays but still the best buddies ever, where's the fauxtrage? http://www.slate.com…GeorgesIV
- detritus0
Bleh, I was hoping he'd simply ignore their blather.
I don't agree with his views or his historical efforts to support them, but I agree less with an unrelated concern very publicly bullying someone for their personal views.
As Georges implies, down that path lie bad things.
.
Personally, I think they were just trying to score points to compernsate for their own internal grubbiness after the recent Justine ‘Going to Africa. Hope I don't get AIDS’ Sacco disaster (she worked for OKCupid's parent company).
- hereswhatidid0
He made his personal beliefs public. He was selected as a very public representative of Mozilla. The beliefs he expressed regarding Proposition 8 turned out to be vastly different from the image Mozilla is trying to project. He was unwilling to change or explain those beliefs in order to better serve in his position so he resigned. Not a single bit of free speech was infringed upon here.
In fact, isn't this exactly what all you "conservatives" find is so great about capitalism? The company did something the customer disagreed with and they (customers) responded accordingly by not supporting Mozilla.
- what image is mozilla trying to project? let's be honest, this is less about peronal views and more about making money.SteveJobs
- I think you're over simplifying the debate here, let me refresh it for you, it's a dangerous path we're taking and don't come crying in the future when you're not allowed to think in a certain way just because other disagree with you http://takingnote.bl…GeorgesIV
- he future when you're not allowed to think in a certain way just because other disagree with you http://takingnote.bl…GeorgesIV
- and this that was posted earlier too, read it http://www.teamrareb…
GeorgesIV - Would you say the same thing about interracial marriage? Making it legal was an infringement on those who oppose it?hereswhatidid
- oppose it? Or women's suffrage? Or working on sunday?hereswhatidid
- I posted that link, George, thanks. I even read it!hereswhatidid
- Guess what? If I publicly express an opinion that people disagree with, I'll get shit for it. That's life, not discrimination.hereswhatidid
- have you read what I wrote, I've been on the side of the discriminated too long in my life to accept this kind of mentality, I want people who are in the wrong to be able to be wrong, not to be forced out, think about how many people should be forced out if we applied the same criteria to everyone http://www.qbn.com/t…GeorgesIV
- I want people who are in the wrong to be able to be wrong, not to be forced out, think about how many people should be forced out if we applied the same criteria to everyone http://www.qbn.com/t…GeorgesIV
- forced out if we applied the same criteria to everyone http://www.qbn.com/t…GeorgesIV
- i'm not opposed to 'getting shit' for my views as that does not constitue a discriminatory act.SteveJobs
- So other people shouldn't be allowed to exercise their right to free speech if you feel it infringes on yours?hereswhatidid
- it's totally the contrary of what I wrote, please re read it, I want everyone to be able to express themselves how they see fit,GeorgesIV
- I really don't see where you pulled that one from? I even linked the postGeorgesIV
- As long as expressing yourself doesn't actually cause any kind of action to take place, right?hereswhatidid
- I really don't know where you're trying to go, please re read what I wrote and tell me where you disagree, I don't see your pointGeorgesIV
- sorry I'm really trying to understand you but it evades me, be clear and tell me what you disagree withGeorgesIV
- I disagree with your overly simplistic "live and let live" approach and how you're applying that to this instancehereswhatidid
- live and let live only works if both sides agree to it. Not if one side is actively looking to stop the other from livinghereswhatidid
- in this case, proposition 8 was actively trying to limit the rights of a group of people, hardly the "let live" approach, no?hereswhatidid
- so the 55% of people who voted against it should be able to express their views because they are contrary to yours, for those of us who didn't always lived in democratic countries it's quite funny, live and let live and communicate don't segregate was my point, but I think it flew miles over youGeorgesIV
- us who didn't always lived in democratic countries it's quite funny, live and let live and communicate don't segregate was my point, but I think it flew miles over youGeorgesIV
- segregate was my point, but I think it flew miles over youGeorgesIV
- No, it just fell flat for me. I get what you're saying but it doesn't work like that in the real world.hereswhatidid
- you have to make them understand, and the blog you posted did just that,GeorgesIV
- exactly, and he chose to step down rather than have a dialog about it. He didn't take the live and let live approachhereswhatidid
- we don't live in the same world man, I live in the world where I need to be the best at everything or I won't get a job because of my skin color, I live in a world where I get followed in the store to see if I won't rob shit, I don't want my son to experience this same thing and I don't believe for a second, forcing my point of view on those who disagree with me through shaming will make them accept meGeorgesIV
- that blog said all they would have wanted was an apology or even an explanation, he gave neitherhereswhatidid
- my skin color, I live in a world where I get followed in the store to see if I won't rob shit, I don't want my son to experience this same thing and I don't believe for a second, forcing my point of view on those who disagree with me through shaming will make them accept meGeorgesIV
- yeah, and if you went on facebook and posted a comment about hating all asians, would you expect repercussions?hereswhatidid
- same thing and I don't believe for a second, forcing my point of view on those who disagree with me through shaming will make them accept me, I want them to speak their mind openly and I'll speak mine,GeorgesIV
- repercussions?hereswhatidid
- them accept me, I want them to speak their mind openly and I'll speak mine,GeorgesIV
- it really wasn't that long ago that people were honest about their feelings, I miss this time because I feel everyone is living some kind of P.C. lieGeorgesIV
- some kind of P.C. lieGeorgesIV
- so should black people have just waited for southern white folks to come around to their viewpoint that slavery was bad?hereswhatidid
- George's what about the freedom of speech of the so called SJWs and others who disagree with himukit2
- if a person I knew went on facebook and posted things about asian, blacks, arabs, white, I'd talk to him, if he kept on going that way I'd ignore him, I won't shame him publicly because he pov differs from mine, how is it hard to understandGeorgesIV
- that way I'd ignore him, I won't shame him publicly because he pov differs from mine, how is it hard to understandGeorgesIV
- There's no way to enforce absolute tolerance among everyone, best you can do I'd say we all have the right to debate, protest and hire and fire as we wantukit2
- debate, express our view and associate with who you wantukit2
- if you owned a business and an employee posted on facebook that they hate all asians, would you expect repercussions then?hereswhatidid
- is slavery and racism over? just because people don't express it openly doesn't make it over. @ukit who told them they couldn't express themselves or your misunderstanding me on purpose?GeorgesIV
- couldn't express themselves or your misunderstanding me on purpose?GeorgesIV
- That includes right of gay activists to boycott and ultimately for Mozilla to force him outukit2
- Or would you just talk it out with the guy while you're customers express their right to boycott you?hereswhatidid
- @ here, people I've worked with openly express their views on races, we're not kindergartener, ffs, I'm going to say for the 50th time I rather have someone speak his mind to me then hide it and not only sfw should be able to judge what is good or wrongGeorgesIV
- time I rather have someone speak his mind to me then hide it and not only sfw should be able to judge what is good or wrongGeorgesIV
- again, you're arguing that it's wrong to actually do anything about something you disagree with. Just talk and it'll work out.hereswhatidid
- it does work out, I come from a diplomatic family, talking things out does work out. if only you knew the number of conflicts that were averted by two parties coming to a table and talking things out without pressure or insults, you won't be saying this, anyways, it's midnight and I intend to finish some work before going to bed, so I wish you all good night sweet princes ** kiss :)GeorgesIV
- were averted by two parties coming to a table and talking things out without pressure or insults, you won't be saying this, anyways, it's midnight and I intend to finish some work before going to bed, so I wish you all good night sweet princes ** kiss :)GeorgesIV
- anyways, it's midnight and I intend to finish some work before going to bed, so I wish you all good night sweet princes ** kiss :)GeorgesIV
- heh, any members of your family devoutly racist or homophobic? you can't just talk it out with those who arehereswhatidid
- as a fellow totalitarian myself, I believe everyone who has "disruptive thoughts" should be sent to reeducation campsGeorgesIV
- I read lots of he shouldn't say this or that but not a single solution, what is your solution to this problem force everyone who has a different pov to hide, resign stay silent, strangely when your own pres kiss the end of the king of S.A not a peep from the defenders of freedomGeorgesIV
- has a different pov to hide, resign stay silent, strangely when your own pres kiss the end of the king of S.A not a peep from the defenders of freedomGeorgesIV
- defenders of freedomGeorgesIV
- saudi arabia is an entirely different subject matter. As far as what should be the solution? Exactly what happened.hereswhatidid
- The solution is being held accountable for your actions. Want to be a hateful bigot? You get treated like one. We don't have to sit silently by and accept it.hereswhatidid
- don't have to sit silently by and accept it.hereswhatidid
- i_monk0
As the only gay in the QBN village, I thought the reaction – delete Firefox! boycott! – was disproportionate and placed too much blame on Mozilla (which had nothing to do with Eich's funding). But then I haven't been fighting for equal rights for the past decade+ as gays in the US/California have: Canada lifted the ban on gays in the military when I was 12, and enacted equal marriage laws when I was 25.
The thing is Eich doesn't merely have an opinion, he was working to make/keep his opinion law to the detriment of millions of people at a time when money from out-of-state groups (like the Mormons) was pouring in to fight their chance at equality. $100, $1,000, or $100,000,000 doesn't matter, he chose to fight equal rights for all.
Holding someone accountable for what they've said or done isn't bullying, by the way. Stop watching FOX for your news.
- the "only gay?" drama queen much?monospaced
- ;)monospaced
- i_monk...you summed it up perfectly :) couldn't agree more.exador1
- detritus0
I'm not American and I don't watch Fox, and yes - it is bullying.
You or I might not agree with the guy or his views, but whatever his views are, he has a right to them and to support them however he sees [legally] fit.
Going the path this OKCupid lot chose to is no more honourable, no more moral than their target's.
- I mean fine, let the world know - shme him, but it's got fuck all to do with Firefox.detritus
- Doesn't work like that in CEO world. Seen CEO's go for far less. So by the general standard it's a fair kopbabaganush
- ernexbcn0
A person that is willing to pay one thousand bucks out of his pocket to support denying rights to part of the population doesn't deserve to be CEO of anything in my opinion.
- ukit20
OK hypothetical here Imagine you are running a design company, you hire someone and later discover they are fascist, child molester or [fill in with belief you strongly disagree with] Should there be a law forcing you NOT to disassociate with them based on their personal beliefs, because I don't think that will actually work too well.
- a child molester is a criminal by law, Eich was exercising his right to vote. apples and oranges.SteveJobs
- Publicly donating $1000 is not a private vote. also apples and oranges.hereswhatidid
- GeorgesIV0
another very good discussion on reddit, I do not agree with everything but at least most people are seeing the hypocrisy
- ernexbcn0
This isn't bullying, this is just a lousy job by the board of directors who didn't foresee the shit storm that was coming due to that donation he did in the past.
Executives of such high ranks are scrutinised and stuff like this will show up, that's what simply happened.
- It's probably not the last time we'll see someone/company tagetted for Prop 8-related reasons.i_monk
- i_monk0
Boycotting is legal and nonviolent, bullying – the repeated use of force or threats of force to coerce – is not legal; thus boycotting ≠ bullying. You're parroting right-wing rhetoric.
- detritus0
I'm not parroting anything (as I implied, I don't exactly consume a lot of right-wing literature, despite what your presumption tells you), I just don't get why a corporate entity has the right to publicly shame an individual using its extensive reach.
Sure, target the philosophy, make a campaign, fund competing activist groups - just don't name and shame an individual for what is to many people a fairly middle-ground opinion that he espoused many years ago.
The question is not so much 'what happened here?' rather 'Where will this go next?'
- detritus0
OK, I take it all back - I've just seen his face.
- GeorgesIV0
I_monk I fully support your cause but as a gay person you should know better than everyone what it is to be shamed for the choices you make,
do you not see the double standard? do you not know what happen when people are forced to go into a direction they do not chose by themselves,
they will internalize it and pretend to agree with you but they will resent you, they will laugh with you and even agree with you, but deep down, they'll hate you because they have to live a lie.
I know tons of people who pretends to be happy with gays, but you get 3 beers into them and they'll start to be honest and say shit like, gay people should be allowed to marry or asinine bs like gay shouldn't adopt or other bs, but the same people will treat you as their equal at work, does it make them bad people absolutely not, it's just that they have a mental block that they perpetuate, and the sjw want to shame them into hiding it,
[Canada lets talk about canada for a bit, I remember when I lived there everyone pretended to be open minded but the racism was present, it wasn't publicly said but it was there, palpable under the surface, just look how they treat the natives..]
the slope is slippery if you go this way mate, we are probably the last generation that will have division in sex (australia just accepted the third sex denomination btw), the young don't care about what sexual preference just like they don't care about race,
maybe we were just born in the wrong generation, so be weary of people that pretends to embrace your cause, those will be the same person that will turn on you in an instant when the hype is gone
- ohhhhhsnap0
this dude invented JS?
- ernexbcn0
http://projects.latimes.com/prop…
I guess he regrets that donation now, or perhaps he regrets that political donations in the US aren't private (unless you use a proxy that is).