Your end of the deal
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- canoe-1
@Mono
So you expect $20 (2/3) of the sale of each shirt? You do understand that you would never pay someone 2/3 of your sales if it were your business correct?
Also, how do you justify 2/3? Is that how it works these days, artist's royalties are now 67%?
I'm sure you have design chops, but do you have flocks of people waiting for your next drop? You'd have to bring some heavy weight to ask for nearly 70% of the business. Insane.
- DUDE, I admitted I didn't know, and I was trying to give you a point of view, which you specifically requested.monospaced
- I'm not insane either.monospaced
- but to take 70% of the profits for doing nothing but broker the production also seems shady, but what do I know?monospaced
- I know you ain't cray cray... we're all still learning here...canoe
- When i sold my shirts at an art show in SF, I earned over 50% of profits.monospaced
- Question, are you not planning any making any money off your own talents, or are you just going to piggyback the entire business on other's talents?omg
- I would pay an extra $20 just for a genuine monospaced original. I think that when you say the shirt is by mono, ppl are going to want to pay more.sarahfailin
- I will have several labels in the store, so my designs will sell... sold out already and thus taking it more serious...canoe
- canoe0
Pretty interesting read... more like a capitalist version of how to make passive money with online gimmicky shirts, thanks for posting it.
- shellie1
You mentioned shopify which will cost you a lot more than just building your own store if you're selling anything. They charge a fee for every sale and do foes paypal. Why not cut the extra fee? Plus shoplify has the worst back end. You still have to pay for extra plugins you'll want anyway. There are only zero shopify fees on accounts that use shopify payments to process credit cards. If you use paypal or any other payment gateway it's a different story. It's very misleading.
I'm curious how you plan on fulfillment if you're not going to buy your own press (they're cheap). But POD - setting up screens and ink for one shirt at a time is lol. U don't plan on printing at least small batches at a time? 100 or so? It's not a huge inventory but I can't imagine it's worth it otherwise. Threadless must be a pretty big operation by now. Surely they keep a baseline of inventory on hand.
As a consumer I find POD shirts are expensive for the quality. Prints often not using a screen printing process.
- +monospaced
- I think he's talking DTG, not silkscreenGnash
- Magento stores start around 5k to build, I can build shopify on my own.canoe
- I'm not at the level of threadless, so there's no way I'd risk 10-15k.canoe
- shellie2
I currently have a 4 color press, flash dryer, exposure box and a collection of inks and chemicals set up in my garage. I don't have a huge business, it's passive but I can sell 50-100 $30 shirts a month. It adds up especially as a weekend thing. I also sometimes help friends out and do small runs for them but there's not really much money in small run printing.
I've done this a bunch of ways over the years and with printing each shirt should cost you a couple bucks max. But if you're charging $30 the designs and print quality better be top notch and order turn around has to be fast. I've learned how to engage, retain and grow my customer base and get them coming back several times a year, and not how you would think (mainly not via social media). Your plan sounds a little naeive at the moment. If you have any questions for someone with experience throw me an email.
- I don't think the plan is naive at all. there's a demand out there for that model.Gnash
- my cousin grossed $3million last year doing POD t-shirts -- fulfillment (printing and shipping). no silk-screen, all DTG. and he's small in the industryGnash
- 90% of his clients are small, on-line shopsGnash
- *shrug* if he's selling designer shirts though that is a completely different products though. Have you touched or seen those shirts before?shellie
- And doesn't your cousin own the print machinery?shellie
- "designer Shirts" in quotes, lol. Ya, he owns it all. but quality is, meh. He designs nothing - strictly fulfilmentGnash
- the shirt quality is good. the print isn't great.Gnash
- you're set-up sounds nice, shellie. glad it's working.Gnash
- ugh! your*, not you'reGnash
- I think I'll pass... I'm not looking for consulting, just trying to figure out what a good cut is for the other brands at the store... that is all.canoe
- Your question is confusing. What brands? How are they using this service? As a brand I'd never pay more than $6 or $7 a shirt so I can actually make some money.shellie
- If this is a place to make 10 customized bridal shower shirts for my friends I'd understand what this is all about more.shellie
- Idk why you're so mad canoe. I'm just asking questions. You say u wanna do a Threadless type thing but all the details I've picked up are a little off the railsshellie
- Nobody can give you good advice on splits with all the players if you're margins look alarmingly off for the work.shellie
- I never said anything about going threadless, nearly 70% is not alarming. And because I don't want your consulting doesn't mean I'm mad.canoe
- If you don't understand that more than one brand is sold at a shop, I don't know what to say...canoe
- omg2
These days, a designer can simply screen their own work, and sell it online for under the cost it takes see a movie with a hot date. Why do they need to give you 1/3 or 50% or even 67% of their sales to give to someone at an online banking system that sells shirts?
- I think the question is upfront costs vs zero costs to start.yurimon
- how much you need to invest plus time for return on investment vs trying with zero costs to start, just time.yurimon
- Any designer in less than a day can design, have their shirt made, packed and posted online.omg
- if you have no space for inventory then its more costs to add.yurimon
- Is this an economic question? I don't know how to compartmentalize the logic small enough for you to understand...canoe
- Do you think DKNY makes 70% on each of their sales? Serious question.canoe
- You're absolutely right, they can start their own store. The question is if they bring other people on board, how much do they make?canoe
- canoe0
So, we've got one company that says they pay designers $7 every time one of their shirts are sold. This happens to be a rather successful company.
Then Mr Mono gave himself a value of $20... which would put the shirt shop out of business. So don't go into a t-shirt business with mono, you've been warned! :-)
OMG says that the company that sells his shirt should get zero money, the designer gets it all. He feels that he shouldn't have to pay for the traffic/exposure nor pay for any operating costs that keep the shop (that sells his shirt) functioning. This is what one would call economic suicide - with this model there would be no vendors to sell your goods and your company would go belly up.
Shellie says the plan sounds naive. I have no idea what plan you're referring to... but since you have so much experience please answer the question that inspired this thread - what kind of cut do you give the brand of the t-shirt you sell at your store? 50% after COGS and operating expenses? 40%? 30%?
- Are you really so defensive that you have to personally attack me like that for a second time? So uncalled for.monospaced
- noticed monos restraint with this user and not going full Tourettes despite a full out attack.yurimon
- Because he doesn't spend most of the time being a cunty troll like you and is actually part of the creative community.monospaced
- ic, so that will justify treating you in a condescending manor and gaining your subversive respect. lol ok. ill do the same. be sure to bow.yurimon
- I thought you'd take it as a funny... failed attempt at inside joke... excuse me Monitocanoe
- it didn't seem like a joke at allmonospaced
- yuri, treat me anyway you want, it will never earn you respect, it will only make you look like a more idiotic trollmonospaced
- lol, well. too bad you come off as complete hypocrite considering your involvement in design oriented subjects. makes you look doucheyyurimon
- ^non design orientedyurimon
- your involvement in all subjects, ESPECIALLY design-related ones, is so fucking idiotic it borders on insanity, self delusion and cunty trolling, you fuckassmonospaced
- xoxocanoe
- lol, not true i contributed. your involvement in non design topics is idiotic. even this topic you gave biz advice that would make people broke. good day sir.!yurimon
- i dont know much but im going to say blah blah $20 dollars a shirt. gfo.yurimon
- nb0
Look to the Good Book.
The one true and holy manuscript.
All answers are contained within.- Amazon Best Sellers Rank: #13,376utopian
- Typical Donald Bullshit about being a "Top Seller"...what an asshat!utopian
- Donald Trump says ‘most people’ read his book. Not exactly.
https://www.washingt…utopian - "The Art of the Deal" is the best-selling business book of all time, LMAo at the BS Liar.
http://www.politifac…utopian - ^politifact is bias site. whos checking the checkers?yurimon
- actually, you'd probably learn a lot about business from this book. remember, Trump is a liberal democrat and always has beendrake-von-drake
- omg0
I said the designer should get $10 roughly 30-35% of the gross revenue which was the described "leftovers". The costs of a seller are responsible by the seller. The same if the designer sells their work, they would have to cover their own seller costs. Without the design I think your company can sell a blank t-shirt for $10, however a designed shirt can go for $30.
- Hayoth0
You need to look at your competitors like threadless.com then figure out your payment structure based off a lot of research into your operating costs, the market and value of your product.
You (yourself) should be making about 30% when it's all said and done, and that is light because apparel is one of the highest marked up industries.
Your payment structure for the designers needs to vary on quantities sold because obviously the more you sell the less it is to produce.
The threadless model to me is the most unique because in some cases they community decides what gets printed. They also create partnerships to create art for tv shows, etc. Is that an avenue you want to approach?
Then you need to decide what part of the market you want to be in.
Do you want to sell budget designed tees?
Do you want to market your self as premium artwork tees? Limited edition, etc.
For me, I don't see a niche in what you are trying to do. Have you tried approaching this from a problem solution perspective?
- Threadless won't be a direct competitor - we're more ben harper than justin beiber - their shirts are mostly hipster, black, and trendy. We are full color.canoe
- I'd love to find a POD that allows me to buy 100 shirts in advance in order to get a breakcanoe
- I'd like to change the vernacular from designer to brand... it's best understood this way.canoe
- I think we will have specials that may have different prices, but the foundation is 30/shirt and building traffic from social media sources.canoe
- plus $2 S/Hcanoe
- yurimon0
Can anyone comment on these tees. any updates on quality?
American Apparel #2001
Alstyle #1701R / #5301
Anvil #780
Bella-Canvas #3001
Cotton Heritage #1082
District #DT7000 / #DT104
Hanes Nano
Keya
LAT #6901
Next Level #3600
Otto #651-201
Spectra Tees #3100
- canoe0
@Hayoth - "For me, I don't see a niche in what you are trying to do."
And what niche are you talking about? What niche do you think I'm 'trying to do'?
There is profit in POD, there's more if you risk the investment and DIY, but that's not my model.
- canoe0
As a married feller, communication is key for me...
So although I never said it, many comments have insinuated that I'm trying to 'create another threadless' and, even worse, positioning myself as a broker for designers.
That is not the case, I will be involved in roughly 75% of the brands on the site. Some of them will be mine of course. Others I will have a stake in the game because I designed the graphics and did not take any kind of payment, my work was for equity.
So, the reason for this thread is that I have a feeling that we'll come across other designers that want to start a brand, maybe we ask them to do a signature shirt for the brand, there are many reasons I can think of which would involve a third party, so out of all fairness I tried to start a conversation up on QBN to talk to other designers to see how they feel and what they've experienced.
Although I appreciate the comments, I didn't come here to talk about a business plan. It may have come across that way because I was being transparent with the numbers, but it's all kind of hypothetical, right?
- microkorg0
On Threadless a designer can get an Artist Shop (new feature) and set their own prices for things.
This is different to the Threadless community voted tees. You just upload your own designs and they go on sale immediately.The base price for a t-shirt for example is $15. Whatever you charge above that goes into your pocket when someone buys one of your shirts.
That's a pretty decent deal if you ask me. The designer has no overheads of buying stock and doesnt have to deal with manufacture or shipping.
A good design could make hundreds or thousands of pounds easily for a few hours of labour creating a graphic and uploading it coupled with some social media PR.
About 10 years ago I started a t-shirt label after getting some "young enterprise" funding. Went out and got a load of tees printed up with different designs and built a custom web shop (this was in a time when web shops were rare off the shelf).
Promotion was on the likes of MySpace and it was hard to get sales. Sold a fraction of what we got printed up. The rest sat in my loft for years and got donated to charity a couple of years ago.I recently launched a Threadless Artist shop and loving the experience and would recommend it over my previous dealings in tshirt designing and selling.
Unless of course I had my own screen printing machine and access to tees/sweats and hoodies in various sizes n colours without having to buy in multiples of 10 or 20 minimum.
- Finally... an experience comment, not an opinion comment.canoe
- What is the cost of starting up your 'artist shop' - Free?canoe
- Yeah, threadless seems to be a designer's fulfillment house, they're probably making 50%, a base of $7/shirt and their...canoe
- catalog is miles long, for better or worse. I would imagine they have SOME kind of criteria for you to sell your shirt at their site? Some kind of standards?canoe
- I can somewhat sympathize with this as it took a long time for my shirts to move. POD takes all the risk out of the equation. Shopify is ready to go, so...canoe
- it's all about putting capital into returns through marketingcanoe
- Do they ask for exclusive rights to sell such and such design of your collection/shop?canoe
- canoe0
What could be the downfall of Threadless...
Join 35,000+ Artists Now
Wow, that's a shitty ratio, you're 1 in 35,000 - how does someone find you? How do they become loyal to you?
What if 25,000 artists are shit, so now you're selling at a shitty store... the only model that works for me for threadless is the artist shop, which sounds really great in theory for a single-minded designer, not someone who is building a brand, a message... it has to stand alone.
- Its same for etsy or any other market place. When those sites where beginning to driving traffic there was an ideal time of joiningyurimon
- strategy will differ now with competition.yurimon
- The downfall of Threadless is going to come when people don't want t-shirts and do not trust Threadless.omg
- Can you build a brandless brand?omg
- drake-von-drake0
- This thread is officially doomedcanoe
- :-(drake-von-drake
- this will open the doors to counterfeiting.omg
- ...or open sharing.omg
- imbecile2
(thx Gnash)
- 4 the WIN!drake-von-drake
- if thats the first thing people see, they might as well turn around and go back to where they came.omg