Freelance
- Started
- Last post
- 36 Responses
- gramme0
The flow of work at my last job (before starting my own business) was all over the map. Sometimes I'd work every day, seven days a week, for seven weeks straight; sometimes I wouldn't have anything to do for an entire week or more.
I was always diligent in telling my boss when I encountered holding patterns, and would ask coworkers if they needed help. Failing that, I did a little bit of freelance here and there—mainly friends and family stuff that wasn't really lucrative, i.e. clients that were too small for the studio. At times I would even show side work to my boss to see if she had any input.
When things really started to slow down last year, I worked extra hours to bring in new clients. One of them was my church, which wasn't lucrative but was good portfolio work. Frankly, I didn't want to bring the work in to my employer since I had such a personal connection to it, but I knew I simply couldn't get away with doing that much work on the sly. After we created a substantial visual ID for the church, I was given my boss's blessing to start taking work for them on the side if I wanted. I also campaigned to bring in another more lucrative client, and it would've happened if I hadn't lost that job for ill-considered reasons already mentioned here. The good news is that I was able to take that client with me, and they are a very big reason I've been able to pay my mortgage and provide for wife + son.
So. Everything was gravy until I made public my unrest at that studio. That was just plain stupid on my part. This is why I now cringe every time I see someone coming on here now and complaining about their job. This place ranks high in Google search results, for anyone who hasn't discovered this yet. I can only be somewhat candid about this subject now, since I have no desire to work full time for another studio or agency.
- yes... it is easy to complain about studio life until you have to deal with clients all the time yourself...vaxorcist
- MrDinky0
There is usually company policy for freelance. The main concern is that you may use the idea that you gathered from the full time job to be used on the freelance client. Even with common policy, most designers tend to freelance on the side. They legal action only comes in to play if there was a conflict, you clearly stole ideas / design etc to benefit your personal relationship & financial relations, you stole clients, you gave competitive edge directly and indirectly (say the same freelance client also works with another competing agency), and you used company time / money / resources / and others for your financial gain. These are some of which I could think of.
- mydo0
I would freelance during company time, the same as i would work on company projects during my own time. at the end of the day it comes down to your relationship with management.
- jerseyred0
Can a teacher be a private tutor on the weekend?
Can a hairstylist do hair on his or her free time?
Can a chef cook for private parties on his or her own time?My old company criticized me and accused me of doing work on company time because of my linkedin account and then when they fired 3 people and my work tripled the CEO actually said to me "if you have time on the weekends to do freelance work then you should be here doing our work" and my response was "will you pay me extra for the time I'd be spending here?" This wasn't an agency though, part of the reason why I don't want to work for an agency.
What you do on your time is your time. I detail on all work agreements that I work full time and do not use company time (full time job) hours for any freelance work though I am available before and after normal business hours.
- Well no one said it was fair. But I embrace your idealism and applaud your thorough biz practices.luckyorphan
- vaxorcist0
I never did freelance work during office hours unless I cleared it with my boss.... and that was rare, like when he wanted to have some of it in a pitch for the agency, to show what the creatives could do....
- freelance work during office hours sounds like a NO to meclearThoughts
- version30
once i brought i client i did web and print work for into my job to get some special production quotes on promo materials, all of a sudden my boss was like, you can't work for them if you work for them and here, your work for them should be through here. i quickly told her i did not take this client from her, i brought them to her to get help with things i couldn't at the time as she has ASI membership, i didn't have to bring them to her, i did this as a favor to her. i don't think i made it past that christmas and got a shit bonus too. she sold the company, which meant the hard drives, to another outfit. so take from that what you want
- dayum. :/SteveJobs
- i see her point to be honest.mydo
- Yes. Discretion and full disclosure. But V3, you were treated less than well.luckyorphan
- dewilde0
dont ask, dont tell. if you ask and they say no, then youll get busted for working freelance. if you dont ask and they catch you, you cant really get busted if you didnt know their protocol.
- vaxorcist0
Production work, on as a true freelancer can be cool... on-site production monkey work with somebody standing over your shoulder asking "when will it be done" every 5 minutes sucks... no matter how old you are....
Alot of this has to do with where you are on the infamous totem pole of agency politics.... a freelancer can be outside of all that if he/she is good at playing the game....
- mydo0
i have a friend who is a 40 year old designer. he only works freelance, and some of his work is for MNCs, he clears £80k a year.
cake + eating it.
- JonnyPompa0
I'm talking about being a 40 year old web designer doing production work. Not owning your own boutique agency.
- mydo0
"if someone is able to get the same service from a designer that they get from an agency, why are they paying agency prices in the first place?"
The agency will start a project, do the branding, create the campaign, build the website, but 3 months later and the client needs a advert, they are probably better off with a freelancer. but not one from the agency.
If you're a designer and not taking freelance you're a fool! especially when now and then you have gifty projects that will buy you that new camera lense. I can't imagine how rich and busy i'd have to be not to want freelance.
- JonnyPompa0
Working for agencies is the only way to move up in this business unless you want to be a 40 year old designer which is pathetic. Like luckyorphan says, it's all about big name brands not "cool" work.
- vaxorcist0
Question: Do you think you'll be doing work at the agency that would make a great folio for you, or do you think your freelance work will continue to be your folio....
A lot of agency work is either too committee-ified, or too marketing-blitz-ugly for a killer folio...
- True. But that ugly often has fortune 500 on it, and that's often all that many clients see, sadly.luckyorphan
- yes... suits like brand names...some can relate to client lists more than actual workvaxorcist
- I have found this to be true, and largely not in my favor.gramme
- Formica is probably the biggest client I ever worked for, and they're pretty niche.gramme
- vaxorcist0
Definately do tell them.
Be aware... a good set of freelance clients may be FAR MORE PERMENANT than a full-time design gig.....
I once worked for an agency that had the following agreement: We could work on our freelance all we wanted as long as it didn't interfere with paid work, and that we were willing to let agency use our freelance work in pitches to get new clients...
- acescence0
if someone is able to get the same service from a designer that they get from an agency, why are they paying agency prices in the first place? or rather, what value does anyone at the agency other than the designer that executes add to the equation?
- An agency can often turn around more options at a faster pace than a designer. Hence, the higher price.luckyorphan
- more voices to the committee. The best designs are done by committeepowertoni
- Agencies have all those people to go to meetings,manage expectations, sell to the suits,etc....
vaxorcist - Agency clients are also used to constant interaction and re-assurance, freelance clients are lower maintenance, coolervaxorcist
- luckyorphan0
clearthoughts:
You are in an interesting position.
Clearly, the agency wants you because they offered you the job. And you want to work for them (I'm assuming), because they money is good and they have big clients that could enhance your folio and experience.
Question is, how good is your relationship with the person who interviewed you? Could you ask them what their policy is about freelancing? Or do you think that would be a buzz-kill, and lead to an offer being rescinded? If you think you can ask, do so. Then if they say that it is prohibited, ask for more salary. Or at the very least, tell them that you cannot start right away because you've made agreements with freelance clients and you believe to the core of your being that providing quality design services is what you're all about, and that doing anything less for your current clients would be unprofessional. Mgmt. types eat that shit up.
Either way, to me, it sounds like the best policy is to inform them. What happens if you are asked to pull a full weekend on a Friday afternoon because the agency got a sudden chance to turn around a killer proposal for an amazing client that you would kill to work on – yet, you've already committed to a freelance gig? It's rare, I know, but that would be exactly the wrong time to kill your freelance contact, and inform your new boss that you'll only be half-available because of your previously undisclosed moonlighting, and could lead to your eventual dismissal, just because people don't think you're a team player.
I'm just sayin' that I've seen it happen. Tread lightly and with full disclosure. No games.
- mydo0
anyone ever taken your employers client freelance? tempting.
- < nah.akrokdesign
- just checkinmydo
- Good way to get black-listed.luckyorphan
- When I left one company, on good terms, the company wanted me to take the clients for freelance gigsvaxorcist
- ... this is because the company changed direction, no longer doing what I did...vaxorcist
- mydo0
I used to work for a company that would pretty much fire you for taking freelance. They were shit scared of designers taking client work, or not bringing in jobs. I didn't really understand this.
Now i run a company, and i have to keep my eyes open for it. mainly because the clients are dishonest. Indeed i've had a designer forward me client emails asking them to freelance. As they see it, why pay an agency when they only get a designer to do the work! logical i guess.
- That'd be very shady if the client went to directly to a designer. Damn.acrossthesea
- CyBrain0
Of course it's normal. I bet half the people here do it, but why would your full time employer even have to know. I don't think it's anyone's else's business. (literally and figuratively)