Paying for Meetings
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- manonthestreet0
hi. The initial project plan and requirement doc should outline all review dates/times, number of iterations, complete design/development schedule, Q & A, and delivery items.
If you do a thorough job it is easy to point out where you went beyond the call of duty with additional discovery and where things go out of scope. Have these discussions as they are occurring and not after the fact if you plan to bill extra.
There is NOTHING wrong with charging extra. Usually the problem is how you charge extra.
- CALLES0
who are you? Bill Clinton?
- drgss0
Paying for "Meetings"
....hores
- kld0
if you are in a meeting talking about work, is that not work? Meetings are usually about planning, strategy, etc. so why is this not considered 'billable time' by some? If a client calls to discuss work over the phone this is still work. bill for your time.
- era4O40
Everything after the initial sales meeting is chalked up to Production Management time and shares the same hourly as everything else. Your time is your time is your time...wanna charge for it? Damn straight...
- Josev0
^ Yes!
Administration/management usually takes more time than design, unfortunately. You should bill for ALL project-related time.
- mydo0
too late!
we never have, but we have a new client that will need a lot of time. so we're laying it out in the initial contract. but if you didn't say at the start you'll have a hard job now.
- WeLoveNoise0
yeh what i thought
to be honest i'm contemplating writing one of those clients off altogether if he gets any worse
- Dancer0
I haven't done for the last 6 years and made a point of it in my initial meet. Now I have some pretty demanding clients and I have started to add in "project management" into my estimate... if spend all the time emailing, on the phone, commuting to meetings, etc... then how do they expect me to do "chargeable" design.
Next year is a new year and a new project workflow and time/payment structure
- p.s WLN – do you have a design week?Dancer
- was hoping u replied mate. i never get design week, why ?WeLoveNoise
- just read ur thread - going into town in abit so will see if its around. whats the address u want ?WeLoveNoise
- In the back. Senior designer – Journey Ltd. ThanksDancer
- okWeLoveNoise
- mydo0
nothing better than firing a client. it's the worlds best feeling.
- WeLoveNoise0
yeh was thinking about incorporating project management into the quotes now. Think thats the easiest and subtle way of telling people.
- utopian0
Yes, I charge for every meeting. Whether it is a conference call, or an actual visit to my clients office. I also charge for the time that it takes me to get to and from the meetings.
- nicemydo
- u sound like a strude business man :)WeLoveNoise
- mydo0
utopian, do you manage clients who in the initial meeting are squeezing hours of info out of you before signing a contract?
do you ever say. ok ok WAIT. no more advise until you sign here buddy.
- mydo0
do you also charge if you call them and the phone call turns into a half hour discussion about the project?
- something like this i would expect u just incorporate into the final invoice under project management surelyWeLoveNoise
- Dancer0
^ I would say that would have to be an educated decision... much like when one deos work for free. For example, one of my longterm clients that has 3 companies needed a place setting doing for his dad's 90th... he was quite specific about what he wanted and it took me quite a bit of reseacrh and time... needless to day I did it for free
- erikjonsson0
working on location on dayrate is the way to go :P
- WeLoveNoise0
theres always a case of doing a little free work because you always think u will win in the longterm. it was just getting to me when this particular client said could i do something "will only take a minute wont it". i thought - ur taking the piss now after wasting literally an entire day for a meeting
- PonyBoy0
include it in your project cost along with your 'time spent saying 'no, that's dumb'' to client ideas via email... never tell them you're charging them for it - why look like an asshole when you can appear great but know deep down inside you took their weak asses for a ride on their dime?
be sure to extend your middle finger their direction as you type up the invoice laughing at the sky because it's merely blue
(*has realization as to why he's having a hard time getting paid on time these days)
- utopian0
To be honest with you mydo, I estimate the amount of hours needed to design and complete a project before I take on any specific project. Which includes: research, design concepts, meetings, implementation, QA, testing, etc... I usually do not take on projects where the client insists on paying me an hourly rate unless I have a working history with that particular client. I prefer to work on projects with a fixed price and project definition, with a verbal or written claus for "scope creep" and or uncontrolled changes brought on by the client and or their team.