London Freelance Goings On...
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- normal
We're getting a lot of clients lately who are haggling about pricing. Our minimum is 240 per day 30 per hour for either of us here at normal both of us being senior in our perspective areas of print and web. But lots of clients (or freelance agencies) are coming back asking us to reduce our rates which we think are fair. Sometimes wanting us to work for 20 quid an hour and promising overtime (yippee).
What are your feelings as to why this seems to be a growing trend, is it because the market is oversaturated and there is a lot of cutthroats working for nothing out there or what? Are we too expensive? What are your general rates and how do you cope with these requests? Stand firm and say it's non-negotiable or succumb and whore yourself out for less than you are worth just to get the work?
What's the dealy yo?
- jevad0
In a competitive market you have to *be* competitive.
If they can get the same standard/quality of work for 10 squids less an hour or whatever - obviously they are going to do that....
- ozhanlion0
well 240 for a daily routine sounds nice here.
how long do u spend on a project is another question
- karlo0
When I was freelancing I charged 25 quid an hour.
Some places would only pay 200.
I EVEN (AND WILL MENTION NAMES) worked for the Pavement for £100 a day.
What you have to bear in mind is if you dont do it at their price you will only end up sat on your arse at home - so as I see it £100 a day is better than nothing...
Now then, I also realised that the are ALOT of SHIT freelancers out there AND I MEAN FUCKING SHIT
For some reason - they always have work too.
If they charge £20 and you charge £25/£30 - they will always use the cheaper person - shit or not!
Its a terrible world out there
Im thinking of getting out to start a coffe shop or a florists
HOW GAY can you get!!
Karlo
- jox0
The main reason for companies not wanting to pay what you think you deserve, is because they don't think you're worth it. Obviously you haven't proven yourself hard enough.
- karlo0
Was that response for me?
- rasko40
I charge £25 an hour, if you give me the details of some of your clients I will happily give them a call.
;P
- jox0
That post wasn't as much as a response as it was a statement. But no, it wasn't directed toward you.
- plamenski0
Yes, you are too expensive.
Plus the portfolio on your website is password protected. Wtf?
- contra0
I'm with Rasko, gimme the clients if you don't want them.
If it's a choice between working for £200 a day or not working for £240 a day, I'd take the £200, if you get what I mean.
- ad10
send them to prontaprint / kallkwik etc and they'll get asked to pay £60 an hour and for what?
- normal0
I agree with the sit on your ass for nothing or do something for cheaper theory. But I've actually been on the same rate since 2000 and it hasn't changed, one would imagine that it would go up not down. Yes you have to be competetive and all that however it's just lately it seems that everyone wants the moon for nothing. We've got overheads, we pay tax on it so in actuality it runs about 20 quid an hour. But when you get freelance agencies selling you for 300+ a day and asking you to reduce your rate to 20, it's taking the piss really.
I believe in getting what you pay for, and I've also learned that when people pay more you get more respect from them. The lower the pay the shittier the treatment and the higher the expectations so it's also about self-respect. Insert your own story about taking on a job for peanuts and it turning into a nightmare, you know you've got at least one.
If we work for cheap we also eventually undermine our collective livelyhood. Yes we love our jobs and that makes it difficult to put a price tag on something we actually enjoy doing but we also need to respect ourselves and our industry to ensure we can make a living out of it.
- Nairn0
..and why have you passworded your portfolio? If I, as a client, were to look at your current site, I honestly wouldn't think of you as being terribly professional.
/no great dig intended.
- Nairn0
what sort of work are you talking about for this rate, anyway?
- normal0
How many clients do you have just wondering around the web giving out jobs to the best portfolio they see? Very rarely, almost every one of our jobs was through word of mouth. Our site is for us and our clients we're not out to compare portfolios. Besides some of our people have different portfolios for different types of jobs so they can control who sees what.
- Nairn0
fair enough. it doesn't come across that way though, and I don't overly agree with your reasoning.
Anyway, what do your rates cover? I ask as I will need to get a freelancer in over the next month or so to help me out, and I genuinely don't know where to begin. Even though I was doing this myself a couple of years ago.
- plamenski0
I am one of those clients.
- normal0
For the rate? Brains, creative consulting and professional point a to point z work.
Obviously if it's just production work or artworking the rate is lower.
- Nairn0
my apologies, I did not appreciate that the 'portfolio' section on your site related to your individual talents, not a client list.
so it's creative directing then, effectively? not technical work?
all the more reason to be displaying the wealth of your creative potential, surely?
- normal0
The rates are pretty much inclusive of any task beyond simple production work. If you need help a good place to begin is here. Let me know what you are looking for and I might have someone for you.
If we ever need a hand in the future we would probably use NT to find our resource.
- normal0
Nairn: Yes, creative direction mostly. But we'll handle the technical bits as well.
Yeah, understandably it's a bit vague right now, we're in the middle of a redux on the site with more of an open house feel. But it's difficult coordinating right now because we're basically a loose collective who are running around freelancing, working in teams, or sourching each other for jobs. So the portfolios are more aimed towards individual talents as that's what we're getting work for lately.
Basically in the process of trying to build up the client base so that we can support ourselves and our business fulltime.