Art or design?
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- eps
I started out as an Illustrator and a painter. Now I work for a huge ad agency in NYC as an art director and I'm not sure it's what I want. There are some days I feel like a total sellout and just want to quit and go back to school and paint all day. My undergrad self would kick my own ass if he saw some of the stuff I was doing. But I hate to admit it, I really like my nice apt. and my iPod. Does anyone else struggle with this stuff? Does anyone else out there think that they were better people/artists before and that they've sold out? I'm in a bad place...someone talk to me.
Eric
- shant0
People who use the word sellout are haters who wish they had cash.
- eps0
Well I'm calling myself a sellout because that's how I feel. I feel like I'm working for clients I'm not happy about just to make money instead of persuing more artistic pursuits.
Not everyone who uses the term is a "hater". You have to admit sometimes people do things for the wrong reasons...
- BonSeff0
"I hate to admit it, I really like my nice apt. and my iPod."
classic!
omg, sorry dude i think thats funny as fuck
go easy on yerself
- dequinix0
I think you should feel privileged to have succeeded. I think this so-called sell-outness gives you and others a buffer to do what you feel like in the future, such as going back to school and painting all day.
- ribit0
I'm not sure he has succeeded? For me success would be doing innovative, rewarding design work, with a high level of 'art' in it.... money just comes along with that...
So maybe the question should be Art, or sellout-but-money-making-design, or creative-inspiring-money-making design?
- eps0
I just remember being in school and criticizing people who seemed to always have some excuse and "someday" were going to do what they really wanted to do. I just feel like I should be doing it now. Is that strange?
I was kinda stupid and idealistic in school but I really wish I had some of it back. I wish I felt like there was something behind what I was doing except making the rich richer and selling stuff. I feel like a glorified salesman which is EXACTLY what I've been trying not to become my entire life. Does anyone else struggle with what they do?
- eps0
"I'm not sure he has succeeded? For me success would be doing innovative, rewarding design work, with a high level of 'art' in it...."
That's exactly what I'm saying! According to my parents I'm doing well and the other people I work with are impressed with the work I'm doing at my age, but what about what I think? That's what success really comes down to, and I'm not sure whatever this is is what I want.
- Tyrone0
design isnt art....there can BE art in design but they're not the same thing
go paint all day but you're gonna have to "sell out" somehow to pay for your paint right?
- ribit0
time to try a different company/start one/go back to school/try a new approach to everything/take a long holiday?
I quit General Motors design after 12 years, and started my own company...now we are the leading online magazine in our niche market... but we havent quite worked out to make money out of it... sort of overlooked that little detail...
- eps0
I know art and design aren't the same, and I hope this thread keeps clear of that debate. I just think if I'm doing something all my waking moments I should feel more passionately about it than I do about my job.
As far as selling art to buy paint I don't think that's selling out. Selling art is just selling. Selling out to me is making money of something you are only doing to make money. Not because you love it.
- ribit0
Tyrone... there's a difference between selling out and selling art...
- eps0
I worked for a couple years for a non-profit teaching Photoshop and art and making WAY less than minimunm wage. It was the best time of my life. They gave us food and housing so it was great, but being dirt poor gets old after a while. So I got a good paying job and now I'm no better off.
I just want ot know that some other people feel this way, and that quitting and persuing my dreams is something that others think about. People think I'm adolescent for thinking like this and are happy with their paychecks, but I'm not. Is that stupid?
- Tyrone0
the implication of the thread to me was that somehow sitting and painting pretty pictures all day was more valid than being paid by a big corporation to help them sell the things that they sell with design. my bad if i misunderstood. but the botton line is one needs to eat. most fine artists dont make enough money to do that. thats why many of us became designers. freelance work can help with a dead end job. but hey, just my 2 cents
- eps0
"sitting and painting pretty pictures all day was more valid than being paid by a big corporation to help them sell the things that they sell with design"
This is why I started the thread yes... but I didn't mean to say anything about anyone other than myself. I'm not passing judgement on thers, only myself.
It's not even really art versus design, now that I re-examine it, it's who you do your work for. I feel like I'm doing work for my boss and my credit card company and not for myself. And I am struggling with that realization and how to change it and make myself happy.
I'm just looking for others that feel the same, I'm not trying to pass judgement.
- BonSeff0
what would making IT as a painter mean to you?
do you want to hang paintings in galleries and have thousands of art fags try to pick your work apart?
im not trying to be a dick, im seriously asking what the validation of something you would rather have is that is not there as an art diractor of a huge firm doesnt afford you.
- Tyrone0
i hear ya eps. i think you need to stike a balance. can't be a slave to the dollar but you need to pay the bills. i recommend doing some personal work in your free time. or go find a job that is more closely in line with your particular tastes. but that willl probably mean less money. i started my own business 4 years ago for the same reasons you're talking about now. it's more work but more rewarding. i stilll end up doing stuff i dont like at times because i need to eat and i need to pay my employees but i do feel much more independant. but remember......unless you're one of the lucky few......if someone is paying you to do something, whether you own the business or not, you're still doing work for someone else.
- kpl0
there's something self-indulgent and ultimately selfish about doing nothing but painting pictures all day. ie, at least sell your artwork, that way your work is useful because someone values it. Otherwise... what use are you if all you do is entertain yourself all day?
I mean, if you want to live in poverty, at least join the peace corp or build houses like jimmy carter does.
Art is crap. Boiled down, it's all a grandoise way to expressing something, something easier done by more direct means. It's entertainment, sugar coating for expression, and overly overrated, especially fine art. Self-actualization is at the top of the hierarchy of needs, because everything else in life is more important.
- kpl0
and your undergrad self is a hater. don't worry about him kicking his ass, I'll kick his ass before he has a chance to. I got your back, man.
- Tyrone0
"art is crap"???? whoaaaa! easy kpl. nothing wrong with art
- BonSeff0
kpl hates on all haters
he'll kick yer hatin ass!
:P
jk kev