Coronavirus

Out of context: Reply #6151

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  • shapesalad5

    @Yuekit If, as you do, you believe the virus came from the live animals at the wet market - how come the people involved in capturing those animals and transporting them a considerable distance to the market... stopping along the way at restaurant and truck stops etc, how come they weren’t patient 1 of a highly, highly infectious virus, causing the virus to spread to those around them... Causing the origin of the outbreak to happen not just at the wet market but at the source of the animals and along the transport route to the market. Any thoughts?

    Plus any thoughts on all the weird activities at the Wuhan lab that just so happened to be working on covid viruses. A facility built in conjunction with the French, who scientists and engineers were unable to sign off on the final construction and running of the lab as it was put together so poorly and ran poorly. There was supposed to be 10 French scientists working jointly at the lab, they all pulled out as the facility didn’t meet the required safety standards.

    It was so obviously the lab as the origin. Don’t do foolishly lap up the CCPs lies.

    The claims you make - are all based on things said by
    Scientists involved in viral research who don’t want blame at their feet or funding cut. There’s one guy in particular who feeds this narative, p
    Peter Daszak. Google him....

    As for the lockdowns in China they are nothing to do with covid. Firstly you have a system where by no officials want to report to their higher ups that they have a covid problem. So they throw insane measures at it to save face. Secondly there is an actual property market collapse in China, people are locked into mortgages on properties not yet even built, etc. evergrande near collapsed along with most other such companies in China. They were many protests. People refused to pay mortgages, banks froze accounts and limited withdrawals. Add to that high unemployment due to falling demand for ‘Made in China’, far too many men vs women in the population due to one child policy, and you’ve got a powder keg of a population ripe to over throw their government... unless they can’t, because they are locked up and isolated in a covid facility...

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    • Sars-1 and Avian Flu had multiple outbreak sites as it was circulating in the animal population before it could make the jump to humans. Covid-19 has only 1.Chimp
    • in hollywood movies labs studying infectious diseases are underground in a desert to make it believable, in reality they're on every hospital site andkingsteven
    • university campus, every route in and out of cities. the impact of the confirmation of an accidental so 'funding-cut' is an understatementkingsteven
    • *accidental release would be devastating to the international scientific community, sokingsteven
    • Yep, there are strong motivations to make this look like it 100% originated from nature and not from the lab.Chimp
    • The CCP narrative isn't that it came from the market. They actually say it came from outside China, so their goal is to avoid taking responsibility at all cost.yuekit
    • You can theorize about the likelihood of lab accidents, in reality with all the virological research kingsteven mentioned there's been no proven case of labyuekit
    • Because that theory has been debunked and they need to distract from the fact it most probably came from the lab.Chimp
    • leak of an unknown virus causing an outbreak. There have been some lab accidents including in Asia but not a single one started a large outbreak.yuekit
    • So that should be taken into account...meanwhile we do have a track record of outbreaks caused in connection with the animal trade.yuekit
    • And the earliest cases of SARS-2 were workers at a market that sold the same species involved in SARS-1 outbreak. There are no cases involving the lab oryuekit
    • tbh that's why i've mostly shut up about it. i think a consensus of "it may have been accidentally released" is probably the best result we can hope forkingsteven
    • anywhere near it. So are people just going to ignore that minor detail of how the outbreak started? :) It seems extremely implausible that a virus leaks fromyuekit
    • a lab but causes no infections involving the lab and ends up at an animal market selling animals that carry SARS viruses a 30 minute drive away.yuekit
    • So why isn't there evidence of earlier infections? Well after the outbreak China didn't release any testing of the animals sold at the market or of workersyuekit
    • involved in the animal trade. All they released was testing of frozen meat and stray cats at the market. Officially they deny any live animals were sold thereyuekit
    • anytime in 2019. And the entire wildlife farming industry was shut down -- around 100k farms across China -- without any known testing.yuekit
    • As far as "weird activities at the lab" so many of these speculations and rumors about the lab have been proven false.yuekit
    • See this thread...even the story about them taking down the database ends up being wrong.
      https://twitter.com/…      yuekit
    • I'm not saying it's impossible it came from the lab but you just have to take note of the repeated fraudulent attempts to prove it.yuekit
    • Ihttps://en.wikipedi...kingsteven
    • https://en.wikipedia…kingsteven
    • i mean, i work in a building with several BSL-2 and at least 1 BSL-3 lab and I am constantly getting emails about breaches and people not following protocolkingsteven
    • i wouldn't take the idea that it's never happened on the scale of COVID as any sort of proof it didn't happenkingsteven
    • ^ Right but notice how the lab accidents involving SARS viruses never caused any large outbreak a single time.yuekit
    • There may be something about the dynamics of scientists getting infected that makes this less likely. They take more precautions than people in the animal tradeyuekit
    • https://www.science.…yuekit
    • Also consider the fact that sampling even a small number of animals from China's wildlife industry turns up dozens of previously unknown viruses.yuekit
    • They didn't find SARS-2 but about half the raccoon dogs (a species sold at Huanan Market) were infected with unknown coronaviruses.yuekit
    • ^thisneverscared
    • i agree, but millions of people eat at wet markets every day there are a lot of unknowns in our knowledge of how coronaviruses evolve and cross between specieskingsteven
    • i'd say the 'lab leak' if a viable theory more likely accidental exposure outside the lab (ie. disposal of samples) i don't think we'll ever know at this pointkingsteven
    • i've read papers about viral samples evolving while frozen etc. there's probably more ridiculous theories than either lab leak or wet market yet to come :)kingsteven
    • You're right there's a lot of unknowns. One theory I read is that these viruses may spread directly from bats to humans and then evolve within the animal trade.yuekit
    • No other known coronavirus contains a furin clevage site, which is something charateristic of Influenza, HIV, Ebola, Marburg and aides infectivity in humans.monNom
    • So. that's a bit weird.monNom
    • Actually that's not true
      https://www.frontier…      yuekit
    • No coronavirus of this specific type has been identified with furin cleavage site, but the most similar known viruses in the wild are very close to having them.yuekit
    • And hundreds of other coronaviruses have furin cleavage sites as explained in the link above. Basically there's just a lot of misleading info that gets repeatedyuekit
    • and it's easy to fool people because it's such a complex subject.yuekit
    • Occam's razor says it's lab leakgrafician
    • Wait boringsalads on this shit too?pango
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