Ableton...
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- Miguex0
^
Could you pick any tune and reverse engineer it to sound just like the original?That to me is even harder than coming up with your own music.
I mean yeah, we all watch the video and say.. oooh that's how they did it... that's easy.. (now that you've seen it of course.)If you can do that, my hat is off to you Ukit.
- ukit0
@Meeklo I guess what I was saying is that while the video makes it look like magic or something, most of that comes from the knowledge of the samples or in other cases, the musical ability of the artist...not just from knowing what button to click in the program!
I wouldn't consider myself an expert on this program or anything but I could understand what they were doing at every step and none of it was too difficult. Certainly not worth paying $1000 to learn.
- rounce0
I live with a music production teacher, if you're serious I can hook you up with him (nohomo).
- Miguex0
^
yes, I think with basic knowledge most of us watch the video and say right! that's how they did it...My question was different though, and aimed to the fact that you need to know and understand all the possibilities available on the software (not what button to click, but what everything does and when yo apply it so your ideas translate to the sequence).
In order to reverse engineer a track, you REALLY need to know your way not only around the software but around music theory as well, specially after achieving the exact track, In my opinion this ability takes years to develop, and goes way beyond using the software in the session mode and playing around w built in samples/presets
- bored2death0
The problem with that video is that it shows you the least special aspect of Live: Arrangement View. You can use just about any audio recording program to get that. Ableton's real uniqueness is the Session View. That's where all it's power is, in my opinion.
- for performance or recording quick ideas yes, totallyMiguex
- ukit0
Agreed, you could do almost the same thing they did with Audiomulch or some other freeware program
- ukit0
- acescence0
I love Ableton, it's superior for live performance (hence the name!), but i still prefer Logic for production.
- albums0
My question thread was deleted, I'll ask here...
I have been given the opportunity to use a friends laptop which has Ableton Live 7 on it. He has told me that if I wish to pay for the upgrade he will upgrade it to 8, however suggests that I use the money on hardware instead. Being a novice I have opted for devices listed at ableton.com as compatible. I am looking at one of the two setups: 1. a Novation Launchpad http://www.ableton.com/launchpad… with an Akai MPK25 http://www.akaipro.com/mpk25 or 2. a Novation Launchpad, an M-Audio Oxygen 25, http://www.m-audio.com/products/… and a Behringer BCR2000. http://www.behringer.com/EN/Prod… The donor computer is a Dell Studio 1555 Vista Ultimate 64-Bit with Intel Centrino 2 T9550 @2.66GHz chips & 8GB RAM.
I have seen setups on youtube that consist of 2 devices so I am wondering if it will be possible to host 2-3 devices easily? I am aware there are some PCI & PCI-e devices however am unable to find exactly what I need, mainly because I'm not sure what is best for my intended use.
I believe that midi devices can be set up in series though I am unsure of the connection requirements of the items I am interested in as most are listed as usb. I have 3 usb inputs on the computer, one of which says eSATA; Firewire 1394, Network , and Mini PCI-e connections are available as well. If it matters there are also a VGA and HDMI connection. I am stating these additional ports in hopes there is another piece of hardware I could possibly plug into the mini PCI-e or eSATA usb port then connect all the controller devices to.
As you can tell though, I am ignorant here and seeking advice from knowledgeable hardware users. If you have other hardware suggestions that you believe would accomplish my interface expectations, while avoiding shortcomings I may not be aware of, please inform me and share your thoughts.
I would like to use one of the two setups listed above or one similar to them, but prefer not to order the items, wait a week or two to receive them, then not have a clue how to connect them correctly or not realize I'm still missing some additional hardware. I figure there will be issues in midi mapping attempting to use multiple devices that are all designed to work with Ableton, however I prefer these issues as opposed to having three devices and only one working at a time.
Thank you for any input or insight you are able to share. If you have any further questions about the computer hardware/configuration in question, please let me know so that I may answer them. I'm not sure if the computer setup is good, bad, or irrelevant to successful operation.
- Dodecahedron0
This looks pretty cool, if I were to spring for a simple midi keyboard for ableton it would be this. If you want to hook up multiple devices a usb router would work. I wouldn't get to carried away though, one is enough until you are a ninja. Ableton handles midi very well so I assume multiple devices wouldn't be too much of a problem except for your own learning curve.
- for all midi connection go to Options-Preferences... sure devices are ON and in/outputs are setDodecahedron
- Options . Preferences . Midi SyncDodecahedron
- orpkoobcam20
I can't even begin to imagine the music you're trying to make with all that setup and waffle you're talking about. If you're new to making music digitally may I suggest you keep it simple and low cost:
Try Renoise first - it's free:
Use a simple but good free analogue synth to learn the basics.
This actually quite a decent synth:
http://kunz.corrupt.ch/products/…And you can find decent free drumkit sample packs to use, for example this one is super awesome:
http://www.orangetreesamples.com… Kit.rarRenoise has native FX's filters that are decent, and I suggest you use a Mac so you can make use of the free native Apple AU FX's that are brilliant.
Create a few patterns, beats, loops and put together a basic track. Then use the FX, EQ and mixer to learn how to mix a well balanced track. Some decent tutorials here:
http://audio.tutsplus.com/Once you are confident, and feel you have talent - and feel the limitations of Renoise, invest in Ableton.
You can use renoise as an instrument within ableton if you get attached to it.
you can use the MPK25 with renoise as well as Ableton and it's a pretty nice little midi input board with a decent low price. it just plugs straight into a usb port so no need for all that space station geek pc stuff you're talking about. Not sure what you are talking about regarding mini PCI-e etc.... You can get a fancy keyboard later if you have talent.
This guy is super awesome, is about 20 years old and is only using fruityloops, a mouse and a crappy old PC:
http://soundcloud.com/robotakihe's done some decent remixes that have been published. All done on a crappy setup up.
http://soundcloud.com/robotaki/y…– you don't need all the gear etc to make decent music - you need talent. So start low cost first. Maybe take a few music lessons.
- popfodders0
You can Time Stretch with most any tool, BTW. Acid music and Reason do it as well.
- albums0
Thank you for the input, especially you orpkoobcam2, However, given the computer for this project is the donated PC, we'll keep heading down this multiple controller direction. I do appreciate the sentiments, though the ideas of song structure are about my only strengths in this endeavor and I understand the Ableton interface more than anyone else I'm involved in this with.
As far as the style of music being made, there is no telling. Whenever everyone is together, we're mixing a live drum and bass drummer with a hip hop lyricist and a thrash metal guitarist who both like dubstep. All 3 talented in their own right. I'm being brought into this as the "computer guy" to corral and somehow record/blend this all together.
The reason for the multiple controllers is for hope of growth of knowledge and that there are 2 others that will likely use the setup often, possibly a third more experienced than all. Each of the controllers selected may play to a particular artists strengths as there is also a digital drum kit that can be used as a controller though its age shows in its latency, a full live drum set and the other individual is a guitarist, being able to record and include their live sessions all in one DAW is important to me for convenience.
So far the only MIDI input really occurring is recording the digital drums in song mode and playing them into Ableton to record the pattern. As a live play device the drummers Roland digital drums do not work, but my intent is that it can be used for beat creation to be triggered later by the Launchpad in Ableton's song mode.
Given the investment the others already have into this I assumed the breadth of use from the 3 selected controllers could be quite vast compared to their minimal investment.
I have used Acid and find it limiting in the midi department and am striving to get away from using the mouse/keyboard interface and use something more intuitive hence the desire to use these controllers that are native to Ableton. I too was drawn to the MPK25 Dodecahedron, it seemed to have the most going for it as a standalone unit. I preferred this device to the others for its price point and capabilities. Its main uses I intend for it are pattern making & recording into Ableton via its MPC pads and 25 key piano.
The Behringer is the only superfluous choice as I only thought it convenient to map out 32 knobs in Ableton and put them on the table for anyone to twist. The kind of options/freedom you gain for $150ish seems well worth it in regards to production convenience.
- albums0
I continued this conversation over at the Ableton forums as well. The advice there was to avoid M-Audio for build quality and step up each of the selected pieces to more production minded equipment. In place of the Novation Launchpad it was suggested I use the Akai APC40 for its knobs & sliders in addition to the pads offered by the Launchpad and the Novation 25 SL MKII over the Akai MPK25 as its mapping features are more robust/intuitive. The cost of the APC40 and the Novation 25 exceed that of the 3 other smaller pieces so I'm still undecided. Any input from hardware users is appreciated as I've heard great sound being controlled by just the Launchpad and a Korg nanoKontrol . Thanks
Also, I found some of this gear used from Guitar Center. Anyone ever buy used music gear? I've bought used computer equipment before but never music. Shy away from or what? Experiences?
- yeah, M-Audio is usually not very good in terms of built quality (compared to other brands)Miguex
- orrinward0
If you want to start doing music stuff, give puredata a try, or the pay-equivalent, Max MSP.
Puredata pretty much lets you make your own custom music applications and perform with them.
- ApeRobot0
Albums: Much more control with APC 40 compared to launchpad,
Combined with MPD or such,MPK25 as cheap feel regarding pads and keys weight.
As orpkoobcam2: keep it simple an lowcost
- albums0
reading http://puredata.info/ now, cool stuff. I had heard of Max for Live, but as I had written earlier, we're currently working with a borrowed laptop and copy of Ableton 7 though making stuff like this would be fun...
this comment from them pretty much sums up what's happening... "normally these device send cc as any midi device, its just fader and knob. You can set the number of control points distributed along the fader between 2 and 16. Every time the fader's cursor passes over one of these control points, a corresponding note is triggered."
i like that notion of controlling tracks/samples with the knob fader as opposed to an individual button.
I also love this use of the Launchpad controller
obviously custom mapped
- albums0
ApeRobot,
Please clarify... "Combined with MPD or such,MPK25 as cheap feel regarding pads and keys weight." Are you saying the launchpad will have a cheap feel compared to the MPK25 or that the MPK25 has a chap feel? What is the MPD you mention?
I've read the Novation 25 SL MKII is more robust than the Akai MPK25 and also smaller but does not bode well for keeping costs down. I'm becoming keen on the idea of the APC40 and Novation 25 but I'm adding $200+ to a budget everyone says I should keep small. Now I'm thinking of getting the Novation 25 or MPK25 first then opting for the APC40 at a later date like next month or something. Between those two, no real need for the Behringer knobs I guess.
- ApeRobot0
Combining the APC with another controller with pads or keys, like an MPD or an MPK.
I'm just saying that the MPK pads,keys,knobs are cheap. (personal feeling)Like for exemple, i'm using.
-M-audio Keyboard (the cheapest)
Laptop with ableton
-APC 40 (i use it mainly for the live. Otherwise, i use it for arrangement and effects tweaking. It is just an extra, production wise)
-MPC2000xl (put samples in it to play them, or use the pads midi synced with ableton)Basicly you dont need much, like, a computer and a cheap keyboard will make it.
- cool, thanks for your input, looking more and more at the Novation 25 SL MKII nowalbums
