Limited revision techniques
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- mydo
Would be interested how you all, from freelancers to big agencies, deal with this issue..
for example, a simple web design contract:
◦ 2 design concepts
◦ 1 concept developed over 3 revisions for sign off
◦ payment & buildbut what happens if the first 2 concepts weren't right, you spend 3 revisions getting the concept right before you start on content. or if 5 revisions are needed, when do you start charging? how big is a revision? what if half the revision is your misunderstanding?
It seems the process can neither be fixed or open. What do you do?
- monNom0
A lot of it comes down to doing the leg-work up front. Good discovery meetings, clear objectives, speaking with the decision makers, agreement on a project brief and outline, and above all the willingness to bow-out of a job if it rubs you the wrong way. Most of my projects that went badly failed in at least one of those areas.
I don't do a set numbers of revisions, but I do refer clients back to original estimates if things start spiralling out of control (it pays to do the legwork and have something to refer back too here). Good clients get that time=money.
- bad clients assume you are a salesman and have all the time in the world before they "buy"... which they might not do.monNom
- acrossthesea0
Why were the first concepts not right? They shouldn't miss the mark completely if you did some basic wireframes and a simple discovery beforehand of likes/dislikes and all that jazz.
- mydo0
often first concepts were right, but once clients sees their idea visualised they realise what they truly need. Or it could just be a misunderstanding. or you may be dealing with middle management who misunderstood their boss.
What about the, "can we see it in these colours?" then you say yes. then the next day they want to see it in 5 different fonts?
- <-- this sounds like a bigger problem to me... like having the wrong idea up front.d_rek
- honest0
Developmental work in the initial stages shouldn't be too much like tennis. We work very closely with our clients when defining the aims, structure and features of each site. This is to reduce the amount of revisions required since everyone is on-board with what is being progressed.
- neue75_bold0
charge to actuals for all changes after 2 rounds of revisions... it's pretty hard to stop clients whom aren't paying attention during concept and design development stages, even when well considered work is created, managed and presented... they tend to just look at details before it's meant to be on press or go live, the least you can do is make sure they know there'll be financial implications...
- neue75_bold0
I didn't actually read your post, but there is a bit of an issue if you're really off on the initial ideas... Make sure you get them to create a brief, or you create one based on supplied info and have them sign that off... then before you start designing, try doing some moodboard stuff with the client first to make sure you're on the same page...
- d_rek0
I think there is sort of a double-pronged approach you have to take with revisions.
First, define them upfront, as part of an estimate or quote.
2 Concepts
3 Rounds of revision to Chosen ConceptSecond, Let them know that revisions after 3rd round are going to be billed per hour.
I think as neue75_bold pointed out if there's a cost attached to their revisioning that tends to bring them back to reality.
One scenario i've run into for revisions is the client wanting to be the designer and trying to use me as their hands. When you start telling them we can make as many revisions as you'd like but it's going to cost you $XX/hour to make them they usually quickly stop art directing. Not always... but it usually works.
- d_rek0
@mydo,
"often first concepts were right, but once clients sees their idea visualised they realise what they truly need"
This sounds like to me there's some poor strategizing happening during intial / up-front meetings. If you get deep into the creative process for Concept A and they suddenly realize that all along it was Concept C (which may have never even been conceived of) they needed then that's sure sign of poor communication.
It also sounds like you may have some account / project management / client facing not doing their jobs. Those people can be life or death for us sometimes... since we tend to get removed from face time from clients on occasion so we're relying on information from 3rd parties.
- monNom0
If they change their mind who's fault is that? Be real with them about the time expended on the first draft and talk options for the remaining budget, or ask for more time/money to do the job right.
Regarding colour changes and different fonts: As a professional, you need to control the project. You do this all the time and they do it seldom... and they hired you to get it done because you know how to do it. You might not get it 100% right the first time, but don't resort to the shotgun approach as it's just going to compound their indecision. When you get a request like the above, find out what they feel is missing, and present 1 proof that addresses their concerns. If they can't express a reason for another option other than "to see some more options" tell them this is the best option, and tell them why it is the best, given their brief. Sometimes people just need to be reassured.
... also sometimes you did a shit first pass and they don't know how to tell you to make it right.
- mydo0
I figure it's like an all-you-can-eat restaurant. Some customers will eat all the bacon. Most don't.