Politics
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- deathboy0
That the state of California would announce a massive, game-changing new labor mandate and pass it in less than a week tells you exactly how much legislators and proponents absolutely do not want a discussion of the consequences. That's precisely what has happened. Both houses of California's legislature approved Thursday a deal to increase the state's minimum wage to $15 an hour over the next six years everywhere in the state. The only concession for small employers is that there will be an extra year for them to comply.
The entire deal was announced and passed in less than a week while economists were still analyzing the potential consequences. Legislative analysts released the report detailing the consequences of the minimum wage increase on the state's budget just a day before the legislature voted on it....
http://reason.com/blog/2016/04/0…
Ugh california... at least thinking positively I guess this means we can stop tipping people to carry a plate or take an order.
- so, you're whining that by 2022 the wage will increase for the lowest paid workers in one of the most expensive states? pleasemonospaced
- where exactly do you think the money will come from to pay for such increases mono? and do u think $15 in redding is the same as $15 in SF?deathboy
- why is it you think this is a good thing?deathboy
- and please explain mono why $15 is right and not $25 by 2022? Jeez that incentize outsourcing labor now would it?deathboy
- *See my post above or below.drake-von-drake
- On the other side, high cost CA has a $10 nominal minimum wage, but that only has the purchasing power of $9. A higher nominal minimum wagedrake-von-drake
- does not have the same effect on employment because employers already offer higher wages to account for cost of living.drake-von-drake
- please explain why the minimum wage should stay low while cost of living increases and prices go up?monospaced
- why would minimum wage not move while CEOs salaries climb exponentially?monospaced
- Wages are influenced by a lot of things and cost of living is one of them. If employers did not offer wages sufficient to cover higher livings costsdrake-von-drake
- then their employers wouldn't stick around.drake-von-drake
- Doubling the federal minimum wage to $15 will be more of a burden on employers in low cost states versus high cost states.drake-von-drake
- Fuck, as far as CEOs go, that's another game. It's a matter of high level execs playing in their own arena and a matter of competitive rates per corporationdrake-von-drake
- IOW, corporations make so much and they want the most qualified person and the market bears those insane salaries. Is it fair, no, but it is what it isdrake-von-drake
- Sorry...
then their employ(ees) wouldn't stick around.
drake-von-drakedrake-von-drake
- deathboy0
@mono
There should be no minimum wage. If there is labor that is willing to work for a fee that both parties are winning. If its too low and no one will work than the employer will increase his price. It's simple supply and demand much like with selling products. If price too low and product sells out u will see a price increase.
Cost of living going up depends on tons of factors in tons of places. And hardly has anything to do with minimum wages until their is a change to minimum wage. Its an artifical and arbitrary forced rule with a ton of unseen consequences. You think when they first came up with it they ever thought illegal immigration would be a problem?
Also some places cost of living has decreased. In a farm town an abundance of crop will decrease food costs. Speculation and business grants can increase rent costs. All that not tied to minimum wage.
As far as CEOs pay going up. Well that too has nothing to do with costs of living. A lot of it has to do with increasing shareholder value, maximizing profits, growth, or golden parachutes. I don't worry to much about that because that is between the boards, owners and what not. Just like I don't question the pay of a shitty waitress who doesn't really deserve her minimum wage. That is between her and her employer.
Minimum wage increase wont decrease the salary of the ceo, it will make him have to find ways to maximize profits still. Which means inventing ways of cutting labor and being more efficient while increasing costs. Automation will increase unemployment of unskilled labor and more of a demand on a welfare state. Also now the people who make more than minimum wage will feel a pinch since they didn't get the bump in pay but they get the increased costs. Lowering the middle class closer to the lower class and furthering a two class system.
And so with all this mono why do you still think its a good thing? Is it because it seems nice and altruistic to help someone? If that's the case i agree it does seem nice. Even could say kind, but stupid and self destructive.Like getting in a lion cage to be nice and pet it.
- I disagree with your logic. Increasing minimum wages increases people's quality of life and adds balance to the distromonospaced
- It keeps wages closer to inflation rates and employers will be able to pay easily with just a little off the top earners and years to prep.monospaced
- To suggest the wage should be as low as nothing is borderline cruel. Just because someone is desperate doesn't mean they should work for shit.monospaced
- Oh and don't make this all about me. I'm not the only one who agrees with this move. Just look around.monospaced
- Preach mono PreachRamanisky2
- A federal minimum wage is a sweeping price floor across all states with zero regard for cost of living differences.drake-von-drake
- Even if you support a minimum wage, it is critical to understand that not every labor market is the same and the differences in each labor market’s wages isdrake-von-drake
- largely influenced by the cost of living.drake-von-drake
- Even Obama realizes a sweeping $15 / hour wage done federally would have nightmare effects for many poorer states and small business owners.drake-von-drake
- Obviously, cities that have a higher cost of living, based upon their own success (Seattle, LA, Chicago, etc.) are able to pull this off well. I'm all for moneydrake-von-drake
- but this has to be thought out correctly, not just JAMMED down our throats again through executive power and a biased supreme court.drake-von-drake
- mono the wage wouldn't be borderline nothing. And a less minimum wage in nebraska has better quality of life than higher online NY so that is wrong toodeathboy
- ^ preciselydrake-von-drake
- your arguments for it don't add up. If they were true it would be the same with a minimum wage of $30 would it not?deathboy
- Guess me and the top economists who out this together have to disagree. The idea that wages would go up based on worker availability is so retarded btw.monospaced
- ^actually, you are going to have to show me those top economists because most of the good ones know doubling a minimum wage would be a disasterdrake-von-drake
- I meant Federally.drake-von-drake
- And Im only directing it at you out of pure courtesy of answering your question.deathboy
- https://www.washingt…drake-von-drake
- http://www.economist…drake-von-drake
- http://reason.com/bl…drake-von-drake
- https://mises.org/bl…drake-von-drake
- mono, which economist say its good? there is plenty of evidence and study done on suffering from minimum wage laws.yurimon
- http://www.nytimes.c…drake-von-drake
- pretty much the system and people suffer from you and millions of others false beliefs systems. I dont even know what it would take for you see facts?yurimon
- Economics is all about understanding trade-offs and risks. The trade-off is likely to become more severe, and the risk greater, if the minimum wage is setdrake-von-drake
- beyond the range studied in past research.drake-von-drake
- if you are concerned about cost of living there are other factors to look into that contribute to our inflation.yurimon
- mono you are subsituting your thought for some other persons ignorance. tell me how this would work in a restaurant with razor thin profit margins?deathboy
- dont take others opinions as knowledge. there are plenty of better economists if your are going to do that.deathboy
- for what ive seen, mono is big into confirmation bias. if he could prove me wrong. it would be great.yurimon
- well its why i would like to break it down socratically. stick on one topic and go from there. there is no other way to teach and learn. maybe ill learndeathboy
- Wow. The three crazies of QBN actually think they are making a valid point and all with each other. So cute. Who would have thought?monospaced
- Next thing you'll say that the whole wage hike was uninformed and part of some conspiracy to what? You all sound completely moronic.monospaced
- That's pretty sad mono, we must have struck a chord or something. I bring facts to the table and you use emotion. Sad dudedrake-von-drake
- I dont know if mono reads up on anything or just some process in his head finds a way to brush off facts.. still a mystery.yurimon
- The only dismissal you made was the logical fallacy of argument of authority by pointing out others. And that u just simply disagree with no other reasondeathboy
- You do see how i find that similiar to arguing with a religious dude when reason is tested and they say just faith, or no thats wrong.deathboy
- Just think about it. Look into it if you so care. There's no ego tied to truth or the pursuit of it.deathboy
- What's sad is that you all argue this on a Friday night while I'm out partying. Then I come back to see you whacked in agreement.monospaced
- If you're out partying, you're a youngster and that's partially to blame for yiur views. I'm a business owner and a dad and husband and caredrake-von-drake
- about what the Feds are going to jam down my throat next. I pay people, in other words I contribute to the economy, not abuse it.drake-von-drake
- I'm 36 and married, kid on the way. I just don't have time to explain why deathboy is completely wrong.monospaced
- but insinuating that a minimum wage is a bad thing is the most ridiculous shit I've heard and a clear sign one's never worked a shit job in their entire lifemonospaced
- trickle down econ is bullshit, and employers would only make wages lower if they could. The very idea of working a shit job for $20k a year is what's wrongmonospaced
- sounds like a lot of excuses for ignorance mono. which is what it is but whatever. faith is a funny thing.deathboy
- Your entire post here and about this has been one big fucking EXCUSE for your ignorance. And whatever, right? It's happening whether you like it or notmonospaced
- So go ahead, keep believing your morally screwed outlook is right while it passes.monospaced
- terry_cloth-3
dr sowell starts talking about the destructive nature of the minimum wage at 31:35. the whole video is worth a watch if you can get over that he is being interviewed by Hannibal lecter
- terry_cloth0
- You art schoolers know better than people with doctorates in economics though. Lolterry_cloth
- yeah you designers!monospaced
- yurimon-1
milton friedman vs young bernie sanders
- drgs0
the slaves shall serve, meat shall be eaten... when the stars are right
- PonyBoy2
What are the chances Bernie and Donald both get fucked out of their efforts w/brokered conventions? You might say Cruz is going to get screwed here too if both parties kick into true-republic mode. Any chance the republicans change their 8-state threshold rule too so Trump has no chance?
- yurimon-1
I reposted this just for mono, cause he couldnt answer to the core issue because it was in the wrong thread. call this the control in experiment
- You and mono should get a thread already.
Oh wait!
http://www.qbn.com/t…ORAZAL - This a critical thinking, truth coherence test. awaiting reply.yurimon
- All systems on standby...ORAZAL
- hold your breath, you stupid ass biatchmonospaced
- haha, mono copped out again. you cant handle truth buddy.yurimon
- yurimon again with his idiotic assumption that my non response is him winning, much like his mom telling him those kids are "just jealous" when he's teasedmonospaced
- You and mono should get a thread already.
- detritus5
I forget - has Yurimon ever contributed anything non-political or conspirational to QBN?
Ever?
- 'non-conspirational' even.detritus
- In the very early days he would ask Flash questions.ORAZAL
- a lovely I<3wood postuan
- But there's a big gap between that first iteration and the yuri we all know and love now.ORAZAL
- First occurence on the new and improved yuri dates back to 18 months maybe. Any one have facts? To debunk.ORAZAL
- yes. posted design stuff. I'm incorporating politics into qbn as an art project. Its a compositional piece, will reveal itself toward the end.yurimon
- 'Étant donnés'
LMFAOORAZAL - He posts his non-political contributions to QBN as drake-von-drake.chukkaphob
- Yurimon told us a while ago that he will show up on QBN as someone else and show his artistic side. He kept his word.chukkaphob
- (nice reference, ORAZAL)Gnash
- Yes, loved ORAZAL's 'Étant donnés' reference. Touché.chukkaphob
- : )
Of course you would get that.ORAZAL - nomonospaced
- nah this account changed hands a few. soon to be retired fo shoyurimon
- many faces of orazal.yurimon
- The real question is, why do you care enough to ask?robthelad
- because this is (was) a design forum and this stinking cunt of a troll has tainted it with his crusty shit for way too long, that's whymonospaced
- in case you forgot, yurimon is at the center of the worst of the bickering on here around the worst topics, and he won't relentmonospaced
- Troll boy Yuri has been very busy with his creative writing lately.utopian
- nb2
- no coffee for you!monospaced
- He just does not give a fuck. Runs away from confrontation like a pussy even though it must be obvious by this point in the situation that someone is filming.nb
- drake, when you say stuff like that, it could easily be confused with you thinking he isn't an asshole and that you're defending his policy makingmonospaced
- yes, crude, but not as bad as the shit he pulled... and I'm not here to play the lesser of two evils, because she's the victim, not a politicianmonospaced
- Awwwww did the poor lil governor get called a naughty word? Poor guy! His delicate Christian ears! My goodness!nb
- It's obvious that the filming starts in the middle of her rant. But, very mature of you to jump straight to conspiracy theory.nb
- drake, when you go on looking like you're defending him, saying she's the problem, it makes it seem that you have no idea what she's talking about!monospaced
- It doesn't matter what her point was, it's incredibly crude to scream at someone in public and call them an asshole. If it were my dad, I would knock her outdrake-von-drake
- no you wouldn'tmonospaced
- You're a real top notch piece of shit, drake. "Inb
- She was heard, which is exactly what you're trying to do here. She made her point to the person who really matters. Should she have done it on qbn instead? ;)monospaced
- verbal threats are not grounds for physical attacks, and your pops should have taught you thatmonospaced
- "If you don't like the way we spend taxes, go beg in the streets!" What the fuck is wrong with you.nb
- Yes, she was heard. By Scott, by the employees there, and millions in the US that saw the video today.monospaced
- these guys are no better
https://www.youtube.…drake-von-drake - STFU VonnieRamanisky2
- At the end of the day Scott defunded planned parenthood and made life shittier for many people. He's an asshole and deserves to be called that to his facemonospaced
- yeah he's also made it more difficult for seniors citizens and poor people to vote.
Fucking drake "get out and vote"
STFU VonnieRamanisky2 - After you punched her in the face or at least pushed her off the seat? ;)monospaced
- Fucking VonnieRamanisky2
- Aww look, mono made a friendterry_cloth
- Awww look, terry's getting froggymonospaced
- face_melter4
7 more months of this. Godspeed, you fucking whackjobs.
- dont you dare oppress me with your privilege.yurimon
- My privilege shadows and towers above all. Feel its width, celebrate its length.face_melter
- utopian-1
A 'tidal wave' is coming that will throw the US into recession.
And as long as you have your money hidden, buried or laundered in an off-shore account you will be fine.
- monospaced2
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/en…
Porn site bans North Carolina Users Due to State's Anti LGBT Laws
- deathboy0
Mono I'll take the bait and comment more than most will read. I think we can all agree that discrimination for stupid reasons is stupid. Regardless of level of stupidity that falls on every persons own opinion and value system.
And you see this law isn't about discriminating against people as much as it is about protecting people from frivolous lawsuits because they didn't respect others peoples beliefs or values in private establishments. In another way its prevention from discrimination on a minority. It is sad that the state is taking preventative measures at all but after the precendent in the OR cake case it seems they feel it is warranted. I don't think it's totally warranted, but the courts are full of morons and trials by todays jurys are scary. Ha a person running for judge tried to stiff my company money before. Such good judgement.
And everyone has different values. Like I would think you would turn down Donald Trump from building a flyer for him. Or at least discriminate monetarily by saying sure for 100K or whatever you felt was a good amount. To force your values on another is wrong. People need to grow up accept reality isnt a big safe space ( i was called faggot on my run today, i think because my shirt was orange ). If a person turns you down, don't be pissed and think u have a special right to their labor, just move on be an adult with a more sensible value system.
- For the record, I wasn't setting "bait," hoping to start or win some sort of argument. I do appreciate the discussion, and will read this out of respect.monospaced
- While we're respecting opinions, I have to share that I don't agree the law is about protecting anyone from lawsuits. I truly opine that the law is basedmonospaced
- entirely on the wishes of one group who wants to openly refuse service to another based on their sexual orientation and christian values and ethicsmonospaced
- Now, we can argue all day about whether this is true or not and won't get anywhere. Just two viewpoints, fair and out there, and mostly contradictory. Peace.monospaced
- *offense to christian values ...monospaced
- well at least your an honest about being a fascist as long as its Christianity its ok. screw the rights of association in business if its against saidyurimon
- politically correct repressed but not repressed groupyurimon
- fucking yurimonospaced
- I've been called faggot countless times throughout my childhood and even in adulthood, so there.drake-von-drake
- I still think States should have a right to decide and if the majority of people in that State decide their morals are against it too fucking bad for gays.drake-von-drake
- Then don't live there. No one is forcing you to live there. The US is a BIG BIG BIG country.drake-von-drake
- Liberals have become so tolerant, they tolerate intolerance. - Bill Maherdrake-von-drake
- http://bit.ly/1SQIjQ… Bill Maher: I Wish Liberals Would Have Same Intolerance For Muslims That They Do For Christiansdrake-von-drake
- AND I totally agree, due to the HYPER LITIGIOUS nature of the USA, businesses are more worried about protecting their asses than anything. It's rhetoric.drake-von-drake
- deathboy0
Mono to bait i was refering to this.
"I expect no less than 35 more side notes from you, and AT LEAST 2 new posts, 200 lines MINIMUM, on the subject within the next hour. If you don't, you fail." maybe not referring to me but I cant help call it bait since im doing exaclty what u wanted.
You disagree with me but can you explain why one group should have the special ability to discriminate against someone? I haven't heard any reasons for it besides that you disagree. Im just trying to understand reasoning.
Take the case of the OR cake scandal. Why should a gay couple be allowed to force their beliefs on a private business? What happen to the rights of the business owner to refuse service and how is it any different than no shoes no shirt no service? You seem to be hung up on the religious aspects when it is much broader than that in philosophy, the groups are merely variables.
And curious how you would respond to the hypothetical Trump case above and a hypothetical transgender person feeling discriminated against in a restaurant that only had 2 bathrooms, would u support their lawsuit?
- That was directed at drake-von-drake, not you.
I can explain, but I already know you don't agree, so it's fruitless.monospaced - Thing is, you know exactly what I would say, so it's fruitless that way too. Personally, I agree with the laws protecting this kind of thing. That's that.monospaced
- hasn't this guy been banned yet?monospaced
- Well I think you don't have any sound non-contradictory reasoning. To be honest. But I can be wrong. I'd actually like to hear it if you would humor me.deathboy
- happy to if this were some other forum, but you and I both know that certain factors impacting this site would hinder that severely *ahem* *points < >*monospaced
- personally, I'm reaching the point where I'm considering not coming back here because of themmonospaced
- ha. well if you ever do write it I'll read it.deathboy
- agree this is a poor medium for such discussions with unnamed distractionsdeathboy
- im sorry, i only post to share info. you are the only one i know so far on here that will comment without a review or stay on subject.yurimon
- everything seems personal. so i dont know why you are so afraid of certain ideas or facts.yurimon
- We'll see.ORAZAL
- it's because you say idiotic shit exactly like that which reminds me that I'm conversing with a mouth-breathing troll with delusions of grandeur andmonospaced
- 4th grade writing abilities.monospaced
- thanks for proving my point, assholemonospaced
- I dont know what you are talking about. I post pretty good vids on arguments. deathboy was really articulate and clear in his explanation. you are the only oneyurimon
- that has been reacting immature for the most part in having a tantrum in presentation of good arguments or facts. its like you have an allergy to facts.yurimon
- what would be refreshing is if you articulate an argument that would defeat or disprove what was presented in the same manor as deathboy etc.yurimon
- nothing personal but i think you just get upset in absence of your willing to have an open mind or be proven to be wrong when you have predisposed ideas alreadyyurimon
- yuri von muntDrumpf
- and yurimon is obviously confusing me with someone else or just arguing with one of his split personalities. hard to tell behind his articulate pointsmonospaced
- its pretty simple. no matter how articulate an argument is or a disproof of one of your fallacy beliefs, such as in deathboys explanation of the intent ofyurimon
- lc law, was not against any community like most reactionaries to news but to protect people from litigation in business if they dont want to bake a cake. whichyurimon
- you still find a away to avoid you being wrong. thats all. it seems that when you get a knowledgeable response to your ideas, you act out like a child.yurimon
- best thing to do is prove wrong, give facts or just ignore.yurimon
- You are an idiot and a lying troll. Keep going and just keep ranking up yourself as the most reviled member here. Keep it up moron.monospaced
- Hypocrite is what you are. Talking about facts when all you do is paste conspiracy videos and shit from fake Fox News inspired bigoted crap.monospaced
- When anyone disagrees with you you go on tangents about consciousness and other made up shit clearly linked to your obsession with aluminum foil.monospaced
- Perhaps if you could communicate at a level higher than potato then people might listen to you. We all know that's not possible since you're a drooling idiot.monospaced
- So yeah keep requiring this place and crying like a BITCH when nobody listens, the mods warn you and you're downvoted constantly. Take a clue asshole. leave.monospaced
- ^ no facts detected. can you make an decent argument or just rant with stereo types which are not facts btwyurimon
- core of the issue was the lc law was to protect people from predatory politically correct fascists prevent compulsion.yurimon
- can you count to potato or are you just an idiot troll who likes to call people fascists as if he just learned the word but doesn't know what it even means?monospaced
- maybe someday you'll realize that you're just making this place worse for most peoplemonospaced
- so enjoy the down votes and being ridiculed constantly by everyone who just wishes you would shut the fuck up already and screw off forever.monospaced
- you won't be banned and you'll never sway anyone so you must be either a fucking mental case or just absolutely too stupid to realizemonospaced
- ^ lol. dude get a life. dont read my shit, dont reply, change the channel. how mental is that?yurimon
- Get off my lawn. ignore me mono. please. thanks.yurimon
- Hahaha. Not as long as you follow me around talking shit and posting shot about me in this site. Not gonna happens you stupid piece of shit.monospaced
- you and trump have alot in common. btw.yurimon
- You two love birds going at it again?terry_cloth
- Won't stop, don't stop. They got rid of their thread, even.ORAZAL
- That was directed at drake-von-drake, not you.
- nb4
- LOLmg33
- He's a masturbative hypocrite.
That's relevant, given his schtick.detritus - Dude, it's a just a joke made by his old college roommate.nb
- Drumpf should change his insult from 'Lying Ted' to 'Fapping Ted'... or he could bring this up as proof that Rafael Edward is a total fibber. :)PonyBoy
- HAHAHA @ Fapping Tednb
- Faptedyurimon
- They all fap... everybody faps.PonyBoy
- MasturbaTedset
- im on a break from fappingdrgs
- I am now on a personal mission to meet somebody named Ted, for the sole purpose of nicknaming them "Fapping Ted".garbage
- Idiots believe anything.Hayoth
- As made testament by most of your postsset
- nb0
Media reporting 27,000 showed up for Sanders rally at Wash Sq Park
- It was actually way over 40,000. I was there.monospaced
- ^ lol. figures. what convincing argument did he lay down for you to cast a vote.yurimon
- are you calling me a liar?monospaced
- is that not a fact? You can't prove me wrongmonospaced
- lol, you have no rythm dude. a complete cracker.yurimon
- How did you estimate 40,000? Serious question.nb
- U went mono? I can't do crowds like that. How was it?bklyndroobeki
- It's very close to home, so I figured why not take a little walk through the neighborhood to see what all the noise was. It was very interesting.monospaced
- ^ you said it, it's just that, "noise"drake-von-drake
- nice. i'd been around that area earlier in the day had no idea this was going to go down. always in awe of our city.bklyndroobeki
- whether you support or agree w/ this guy or not -- the fact that there were this many people in 1 small park... kind of amazing. y not take a peekbklyndroobeki
- mg331
Drake, and anyone else guilty of this, it would be absolutely incredible if you could just let a comment by someone about a candidate be discussed in the context of that person, and not feel the need to interject all the time about an opposing candidate. Ex: replying to a comment about Ted Cruz with a "you could say [insert litany of issues] about Hillary..."
Seriously, it's so unnecessarily distracting. I don't know why people have the need to do constantly deviate from a topic just to get their jabs in.
- Especially when there's ample opportunity in the form of a Hillary thread to say whatever you want about her. I don't like her either to be honestmg33
- But seriously, it's chaos sometimes to weed through comment replies when everything goes in so many unrelated directions.mg33
- JazX is back!robotron3k
- yupmonospaced
- thought the same thing. infuriating actually.inteliboy
