Copying Vespa
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- 23kon
Copying vespa's "music feedback workshop" here:
I'm working on a new cd's worth of tunes, got about 15 on the go which will be wittled down.
I've posted up 4 of them that are finished but have still to be mastered. These newer ones are from 'space travel made easy'.
Theres some older stuff up there too if you fancy listening-on. Bit more laid back than the newer stuff.
What's folk think of the music? old and new.
- vespa0
hey 23kon – good work! i've only listened to the first 3 so far but sounding good, what sort of kit do you use? i'm liking space travel made easy, it's nice to hear music that works over a such a long timeframe...
- 23kon0
thanks vespa :) it's ableton live 6 that I use with all sorts of virtual synths like kory legacy, albino, vanguard. The older stuff was done in cubase with the same plugins. Older stuff also has guitar and bass in it. I used to have a microkorg and groovebox 303 but sold them last year to opt with a smaller setup. Just use a novation midi controller to play keyboard. And comes out through my hifi as monitors hehe
- Nairn0
Um.. I'm listening through and did have a notepad open in the background, taking notes on each song - but I kinda got distracted, so haven't made any notes these last few tunes.
I think it might help if you cut out what you think is questionable and let us focus on the good stuff.
Part of the reason I got distracted is that is that I'm actually quite enjoying the 'Sampled' stuff and forgot I was supposed to be 'analysing' it.
I'm going to go out on a limb here - the 'sampled' stuff is your more recent, better stuff? (*crosses fingers*) - it's just that I only have notes on the 'space travel made' songs, which are a mix of interesting concepts and ... well, I don't want to get specific just yet. But they're the songs I had the most problems with.
My only significant criticism of the 'sampled' stuff is that I recognise the samples from DJ Shadow et al and can't help drawing comparisons and wondering 'why?'. Also, I don't really listen to that type of music much any more, as it all started sounding a bit samey to me about 7 years ago (and, back when I and an old housemate fiddled around, making tunes - he'd always do looping sample stuff, and it annoyed me how he could eke good-sounding results from very little of his own creativity - just ripping other people's stuff off. = I slightly distrust it).
Just got to the Lamb remix now - anyone who likes and wants to modify Lamb is OK in my book :)
- y'know what? On this 3rd listening, the 'Space Travel Made' tunes are growing on me - they do have problems ..Nairn
- .. though - some of them down to 'mastering' problems, some down to repetitive, trite elements that bug me. ..Nairn
- .. others down to not pushing yourself as far as the tunes hint you can. I'll be specific tomorrow, if you like.Nairn
- - Music, more than design (for me) is much more personal - so please don't feel offended by anything I've said -Nairn
- - I'm really quite impressed!Nairn
- (Gosh, like impressing me something to behold. I don't mean to come across so arrogantly here, 'onest)Nairn
- Oops. I just re-read your original post. er... je suis un spacker.Nairn
- robotron3k0
just very high level comment. very impressive. def can listen to this on my ipod. why don't you do a qbn mix for us when you finish mastering... that would make you cool around here.
- 23kon0
Cheers Robo, aye i'll maybe put up some kind of mix for the QBN lot when the latest cd is done.
Nairn, thanks for the crit on the stuff. Certainly nothing wrong with someone picking up on the negative points about the music - thats more help than people going "great stuff! and singing its praises and just being polite".
The older stuff is the more laid back sample stuff. Some of that stuff is realllly old, up to 7 years some of them. There are a lot of same samples that DJ Shadow used, and some of the songs are a bit of a homage lol, but hopefully ive used the samples in a different way.
That stuff really is chilled stoned beats, i do like that stuff a lot and actually listen to it a fair bit when im chilling. Which is quite strange for a musician i guess - i know a lot of artists dont listen to their own stuff at all outwith creating it.The newer stuff is a move away from this sampleheavy stuff with the hope of creating a demo i can punt around that can catch the ear of a label. And I dont think theyd be too keen on stuff that was toooo sampleheavy as royalties would be flying out here there and everywhere and legalities behind samples etc - everything would have to be cleared.
So this newer stuff has a lot less samples and me playing the stuff myself.Id be interested to know what made you not like the newer stuff.
Did you mean the style of music (you preferred the more chilled beats) or was it the composition/flow of the music.Personally i think these songs work but i think that good mastering will give them a better flow to them and will help space-out the layers to add more depth of sound.
I think i know what you mean about not doing as much with the songs as you realise i'm capable of.
Ive been working in ableton live in the timeline way of working (like cubase) rather than the Scene way of working which allows you to use the program more like a sketchpad and record as you fanny about which add for a more creative approach.
Whereas with the timeline way - you have to plan ahead or have an idea of how the song is working in your head before putting it down.
And thats the way ive been working until now, but ive been learning the "Scene" way of doing things so unfinished songs will be finished this way so you might hear more of a "flow" to them.Thanks for your indepthness with your comments Nairn, really wasnt expecting anything like that.
If you would like to be more specific about what you think the pitfalls of the newer stuff is then i'd respect your comments.
- digdre0
Dope
- 23kon0
cheers digdre :)
- 23kon0
bumped for the weekend crowd
- digdre0
still dope.
- neverblink0
Just a science: What I felt with this song was that the samples came in quite abrupt/unexpected. Especially in the beginning of the track, which might just mean that I had to get into the groove.. once I got into the rythm it was easier to predict when samples would come in, which gave it a more relaxed listening experience. Maybe somehow easing into the samples (building up volume?) would help with this.
Groovy Girl: The talking in the intro gave me an UNKLE feel. The beats didn't do it for me.. I don't know - they remind me of my little brother playing around with some off-the-shelve samples - sorry. Especially that 'clap' can use some work.
Space Travel made Easy: I like the fluctuating in the main loop, if you could do some panning around my headphones, that would be great! (and it would fit the concept of motion). At 2:30 I got the feeling it lacked a layer, like a vocal sample. But at 3:20 in comes that squeaky sample and took that feeling away. It somehow makes it a bit too happy for me.. I liked the song better at the beginning, more minimal.
Love Comedown: Although I don't really think the intro matches the rest of the song. I dig this song.. with the guitar-synth-esque samples it has a bit of a Daft Punk feel to it. I love what you did to the vocals. At 2:55 I expected it to go to the next level, instead of taking a step back and loose the vocals. I half expected a cleaner version of the vocals to come in without the guitar-synth sample, and then coming all back together. This is my favorite track of these four!
- Nairn0
Shitsticks, i forgot about this thread.
- 23kon0
Nairn, aye if you still have the notes you were jotting down for each song, theyd be much appreciated. good or bad - all crit is good.
Neverblink: Cheers for your thoughts on each song.
with just a science some of the samples do sound very abrupt but i dont think its too bad, adds a little 'catch your attention'. in the final mastering it might flow easier with more of a warmth added to these sounds.One of my mates thinks space travel made easy sounds better when its minimal at the start. its actually meant to be happy - the song is like a journey starting off dark then getting happy then a bit of wonderment in the strings at the end. I kind of picture it as the start being in a rocket exiting earth then the happy bit is being weightless then the end with the orchestra is like going out on a spacewalk.
Cheers for the positive feedback about lovecomedown. i think i know the bit you dont like - when it all dissapears to nothing - thats actually a mistake, i somehow fucked up that bit without realising and after just looking at the file i mustve saved it like that - GRR!
think it does need a new level so what i think im going to do is bring in the intro kind of sound then build that up then bring it all back in.If you like lovecomedown over the others then you'll probably like a lot of the other stuff thats unfinished.
- ukit0
Nice work 23kon!
I really like the last two tracks, especially "Love Come Down." The sample on that one is really catchy and I could see it being a big hit if it was put out my a big label. I also like the melody on "Space Travel," it reminds me a little of the feel of that old trance track "1998" by Binary Finary.
The first two - I wasn't so enthusiastic about. They feel like "paint by numbers" trance to me. Good enough for a car commercial or something, but we've heard it before, you know? Also, this might seem like nitpicking, but the track titles kind of ruin it for me. "Groovy"..."Space Travel"....it makes the music seem more generic and cheesy than it is.
Overall, I would say it's important to develop your style. I think that in electronic music, it's easier to stand out if you have a characteristic sound instead of jumping around too much. I have to admit I don't listen to trance all that much, but, anyway, I really liked the last two tracks. Good luck!