Intelligent design
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- pavlovs_dog0
religion and politics, liquid knows what this thread is about.
- discipler0
hehe, whatever helps you, pavlov.
Denial ain't just a river in egypt.
- liquid0
its annoying that he keeps going...and whats more annoying is that I keep reading....
- discipler0
oh liquid, just sit back relax and be happy about the fact that science points decidedly toward a purposeful creator.
:)
- pavlovs_dog0
and i awlways like to remind the xtians... your lossing the religion war on other fronts as well.
- discipler0
well pavlov, might be a concern if Biblical Christianity was "religion", but it's not. ;)
- danthon0
Incompetent design
- pavlovs_dog0
hehe, whatever helps you, pavlov.
Denial ain't just a river in egypt.
discipler
(Dec 20 05, 10:52)ok
stating somthing cant happen is a testable prediction?
are you kidding?
id is all negative statements.
not one perdiction.
not one thing to test.
not science.
- ukit0
lol-
Regarding incompetent design, why is the creator not intelligent?
I didn't say that! We don't get into religion. The last thing we want to do is get into arguments of religion, a creator and so on. We're just: "Is there, or is there not, intelligence in the design?"
- pavlovs_dog0
That Incompetent design article is fucking brilliant.
- discipler0
danthon, the word for this line of reasoning is "dysteleology". The flawed notion of pointing to apparent "bad" design in biological systems as proof of no designer. It makes a number of errors...
- Never provides an absolute standard of perfection in order to determine if something is "bad" design. A perfect standard is required. Otherwise assumptions are unwarranted.
- Relating to the first point, how do we know that the designer did not implement limitations for better of the overall system? Any engineer will tell you that certain parts of machines/motors are configured sub-optimally so that other parts of the system can function better. Purposed limitations.
- Relating to the previous point. How do we know that the overall ecosystem will not be severely damaged if limitations were not in place? If a predatory animal were perfectly efficient, it would cause it's pray to be extinct and thus the predator becomes extinct. Where's the standard for this measurment?
- It is a theological argument to say that the designer is unintelligent, not a scientific one.
- Dysteleology ignores the scientific laws of thermodynamics which demonstrate that the universe is running out of useful energy and things become less efficient and break down.
- discipler0
heh, it's called falsification in science, pavlov. Learn.
- pavlovs_dog0
Yera Kook....
The End.
- discipler0
I'm uncomfortable with the theistic implications of what you're showing and I'm not objective.
The End.
pavlovs_dog
(Dec 20 05, 11:05)
- ukit0
Indeed - this is getting old, again. Just wanted to point out the interesting news today.
- liquid0
Indeed - this is getting old, again. Just wanted to point out the interesting Newstoday™.
ukit
(Dec 20 05, 11:10)
-----------------------
correction.
- no-spin-zone0
http://www.actionbioscience.org/…
Great debate on the topic.
- discipler0
Why Intelligent Design is Not "Optimal" Design:
- ********0
"A common strategy of opponents to design in biology (like Stephen Jay Gould, Richard Dawkins, and Francisco Ayala) is to assimilate intelligent design to one of these categories--apparent or optimal design."
discipler, I believe I told you that my paleontology professor was a roomate and friend of Stephen Jay Gould, when they were at Columbia. Crazy man actually, he was a wild drunk. Passed away already. A statistical and linguistic genius. I've heard him speak a number of times, but believe me, the use of his adjectives alone would lose all here.
- discipler0
Gould was interesting, though I'd contest the claim that he was a "statistical expert". If he were, he would not have been an evoloutionist. But, a colorful character, none the less, from what I understand. And one of the few Darwinists who was not afraid to challenge his peers' ideas about things.