Politics
Politics
Out of context: Reply #25468
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- IRNlun6-3
A blasphemy law has now been passed in Canada. Western Nations are suffering from a serious cultural crisis.
Canada passes M-103 "To stop Islamophobia and all forms of systemic racism and religious discrimination"
- Does this mean that pop culture / media will stop shitting all over judaism and xtianity at every turn or is this just a pc islamic thing?PonyBoy
- Would be interesting to see if it's applied evenly, which would make this even more concerning.IRNlun6
- laws to tell us what we can and can not say.... Who votes these buffoons into power??inteliboy
- Fortunately, it's not a Bill or a Law. It's a non-binding motion.Gnash
- https://media.giphy.…moldero
- How's this blasphemy???
I'm Canadian and i'm totally in favor of this law. Woot woot.pango - the gov't could draft legislation at a later time, but for now m103 will make no change to the criminal codeGnash
- Well it's not exactly a law to be accurate. but more of acknowledgement that the govnt will condemn Islamophobia.pango
- most objections to this motion has been around the use of the word, IslamophobiaGnash
- Don't go cry your pants off just yet. it's not going to effect your freedom of speech.pango
- not sure it's really about freedom of speech as much as it is balance in 'phobia'. Jews / Xtians (especially Xtians) are a constant target of jokes / ridicule..PonyBoy
- ... in western pop culture (for proof see the 'religion' thread)... whereas islam is treated like a minority or an endangered species.PonyBoy
- last stats Canada data had 3x hate-motivated crimes targeting the Jewish religion vs MuslimGnash
- which they are... there has been way more attack towards them than them attacking others.pango
- Take a scroll through Religion thread and notice which religions can be liberally ridiculed.IRNlun6
- Xtians hasn't really been attacked. And in Canadian history, Xtians+Govt has been the main source of systematic oppression toward minority.pango
- our criminal code already addresses all forms of religious discrimination and systemic racism.Gnash
- And it took free, open, and difficult communication to change that. Catholicism didn't change on its own accord.IRNlun6
- towards practically every minority who's not white. Indian, american indian, chinese, japanese, and now Muslim.pango
- One good point in the article is Muslims deserve protection, not Islam.IRNlun6
- ugggghhhh this is getting really confusing with the way notes are...pango
- lol, i know!Gnash
- "religious people deserve legal protection, but religions do not"Gnash
- "cultural crisis" ??
this is nothing. try... taken away from home by govt+Xtians when you were a child, stripped away your own language and identity.pango - Yes, cultural crisis where illiberal laws are passed to appease a religion.IRNlun6
- you read what i wrote right? "taken away from home by govt+Xtians when you were a child, stripped away your own language and identity.“pango
- this is not a law. but a motion. because the recent raise of attack towards Muslim.pango
- And what laws support that? Do you think Islam is free from having committed atrocities?IRNlun6
- and it's not exactly forced down the throat. 3 out of 5 parties voted for it. 201 vs 91. 2/3.pango
- what laws support what?pango
- in canada? no. why?pango
- Canada just recently criminalized incorrect use of gender pronouns. It's not a leap to think this bill will be expanded.IRNlun6
- uggghhh i'll come back later and see what's up. You're crying over something that doesn't effect you even if you are Canadian.pango
- We did? where you get that info?pango
- (bill C-16, pango)Gnash
- (not using someone’s preferred pronouns be considered discrimination under the new human rights legislation, it would be a form of hate speech)Gnash
- oh that. most of the provinces and territories already include gender identity and gender expression in their provincial Human Rights Codes.pango
- feds are just saying "ughhh i guess it's a thing now"pango
- (*could, not would)Gnash
- and you know what? no one will ever be criminalized by mistaken or misuse a person's gender pronoun.pango
- if you haven't noticed, I tend to argue about many thing that don't effect me.IRNlun6
- unless they intentionally refuse to use what the said person prefers.pango
- ^ yes, that can be construed as a hate crimeGnash
- we digress...Gnash
- ya. same here. but why you trying to stop(oppose) other people getting what they want?pango
- the whole pronoun thing annoys me too but it make other people's life better and doesn't effect me.pango
- I get you, it's an asshole move, but should you go to jail for it? personally, I don't think so.Gnash
- it's unjust laws and legal consequences that annoy me. society can't work through its problems if it has legal minefields regarding speech.IRNlun6
- that part, i agree.pango
- that's very true, IRN. It's only though free discourse the society addresses it's issuesGnash
- well M-103 is still not a law. and id like to see the day somebody actually gets charge because bill C-16. Just so we know what would actually happen with it.pango
- because i'm not major in law and i don't think any of you are as well.pango
- I imagine what will mostly happen with C16 is it will inform HR policies, and result in job loss if you refuse to use pronounsGnash
- This is why I'll stick to my translation of the quote you posted. :) Free speech/press can be ugly, lies, and conspiracy. But critical to a free society.IRNlun6
- RE: M103, I think we should be free to criticize any religion or doctrine without fear of prosecution.Gnash
- there’s a big difference between discriminating against Muslims and criticizing Islamic doctrineGnash
- the word, Islamophobia, conflates the twoGnash
- i seriously doubt there will be prosecution criticize Islam. however if you go to a mosque and scream camel jockey. you deserve it.pango
- lol, yup. natural consequencesGnash
- Take this situation for example:
http://www.cbc.ca/ne…Gnash - ^ We should obviously be able to speak out against this without being thought of as racist or islamophobicGnash
- Again. seriously doubt anyone criticizing Imam's statement will be prosecuted.pango
- but should we moan about an athlete wearing a hijab? http://din.az/wp-con…Gnash
- ugghhh someone should get charged because of M103 already. that way we truly know what would happen.pango
- ... I don't think so. But the area in the middle gets grey and who decides where the line is.Gnash
- even thought it's not a law...
Has anyone of us read the detail of M103? cuz i haven't.pango - again, we already have laws that addresses all forms of religious discrimination and systemic racismGnash
- maybe that's why it's not a law but a motion. to acknowledge raise of attacks on Muslim in Canada.pango
- uggh *and to condemn the increased attack on Muslim community.pango
- Ya, I don't think it's that big a deal, actually. It's only a motion.Gnash
- I think it would have been almost a unanimous vote if they changed the word, Islamophobia, to 'Anti-Muslim Bigotry'Gnash
- mehhh perhaps.
and there will always be people be like "blasphemy!" "serious cultural crisis!"pango - IRN - you really do whine a lot don't you.fadein11
- All religion can and should be ridiculed publicly without consequence because it's all stupid.monospaced
- oh please, I'm not nearly as emotionally invested in these conversations as you think...IRNlun6
- and yes it's a crisis since so many left/progressives are obsessed with fetishizing anything foreign or ethnic that it throw away...IRNlun6
- ... it's own principles on equality.IRNlun6
- Shitty comment fadein. Every man should critically analyse new laws, especially when they potentially plans the way to curbing free speech.set
- It's a sad day when analysing and discussing new laws is labeled as whining..set
- ... And to tell him he whines a lot after you're all constantly shitting tears over trumpset
- Bit rich.set
- Don't you dare criticize group X. Group X can only be seen in a positive light, and not as a full human being with character flaws and all.IRNlun6
- This isn't about simply stereotyping or criticizing, it's about stopping hate crimes no? pretty sure it's still okay to criticize without discrimination or hatemonospaced
- Imagine being viewed as a terrorist just because of your religion. That must be shifty.monospaced
- Anyway. "Khalid’s motion changes no existing laws nor does it create any new laws." it's simply not a threat to free speech.monospaced
- Stop whining. Bigger fish to fuckin fryfadein11
- @set he's a whiney little right wing bitch and i will say what i fucking like (free speech ya)fadein11
- And what mono said. Preventing hate crime is not anattack on free speech. Its not even a law ffs. Move on and tackle the real issues. Sideshow nonsensefadein11
- It's called discussion. Are you suggesting people should only ever talk about the biggest issues on the planet? That's retardedset
- IRN. If you think this is cultural crisis. You don't know what cultural crisis is. And quite frankly, You are whining.pango
- Everyone. I feel like we are arguing about different thing here.pango
- This motion is not a law. Even if it is, you are not going to be prosecuted for crtisizing Islam.pango
- This is to make it extra clear the Canadian govt condemn bigotry toward people who practices Islam.pango
- This is the reaction towards the recent raise of white supremacist influence. and people being attacked and killed simply cuz theyre being associate to Islam.pango
- This is not going to take away any of your current right (Canadians). This reinforces the current law meant to prevent hate crime.pango
- exactlymonospaced
- exactlyfadein11
- @set - lol, come on now - you are much brighter than that.fadein11
- you claim to be"far left" yet see a bill fighting hate crime as an attack of free speech. you are like a QBN chameleon - no consistency.fadein11
- Set far left? Not even. I don't even see my self as far left but I know I'm further left than set.pango
- We'll see now won't we. It's been working great in Europe so far according to fadein11.IRNlun6
- Shocking how a 2nd generation British Muslim is responsible for the latest terror attack. How could this have been possible?IRNlun6
- They have an M-103?pango
- A lone wolf nutjob influenced by the endless stream of fear broadcast on MSM. This has nothing to do with Islam.fadein11
- @pango - he said it himselffadein11
- IRN - frame it how you like though - if it fits your right agenda of course ;)fadein11
- IRN - eat has been working great in Europe? Please don't talk about problems in Europe when you have a mass shooting in your country every week (at least)fadein11
- committed by your own citizens... seriously - take a look at your own problems before you start wetting your panties over occasional tragedies in Europe.fadein11
- eat = what*fadein11
- What's been working great in Europe? 2nd generation British Muslim? He's a jamaican convert. Born Adrian Elms. Check yo'self and reformulate your thesis kthxbaiKhurram
- IRN doesn't research anything Khurram - he just gets triggered when he hears the word Muslim.fadein11
- He's not worth the effort - he's engulfed in fake news barely keeping his head above the water.fadein11
- He's aight. There's more obstinate nativist/tribalist types on here. :)
Peace & Love!Khurram - yep - me. I will be gone soon.fadein11
- Khalid Masood, born as Adrian Russell Elms; 2nd generation British citizen, born in Dartford Kent. You mistake my interest in this subject fadein.IRNlun6
- 2nd generation British citizen? He wasn't born a Muslim is the point. He converted late in life. What are you on about?fadein11
- But aside from this he was a lone wolf copycat nutter - no different to all the nutjob Amercian citizens who go on rampages in US every week.fadein11
- uh dude, you were clearly implying he was born a muslim to immigrant muslim parents lolKhurram
- He attacked parliament with a knife - such sleeper cell sophistication and funding? But carry on making a tragedy fit your hate filled agenda.fadein11
- I have friends that I very much care for who are muslim. I do make an effort to learn as much about history and current events on this subject as possible.IRNlun6
- fair enough - don't get your knickers in a twist over bills being put in place to protect your friends then. Look whatever. I will be gone soon.fadein11
- fade! take it down a notch! I'm enjoying your posts but IRNlun6 is not hate filled. These are difficult times, we must allow the moderate right to have a voice.Khurram
- and don't be gone! keep speaking :)Khurram
- Yep - I got triggered by the right complaining about a minor bill put in place to protect people. But you are right..fadein11
- Sorry IRN for getting annoyed but I strongly dislike the sentiment.fadein11
- I enjoy the conversation. No harm meant.IRNlun6
- I appreciate that Khurram.IRNlun6
- sure. a conversation or whatever. it's still a stupid statement calling this a Western Nations' serious cultural crisis.pango
- when this western nation(canada) has a history of stripping other people's cultural away.pango
- many people suffered and life's were lost during that process.pango
- now there's a motion. not even a law. to condemn bigotry. and you call it a cultural crisis. pfffffffffpango
- also it's hard to forget you posted a video made by a fascist group showing them provoking muslin neighborhood.pango
- and call it a proof of no go zone. you are not gonna get a pass for posting bs like this and that.pango
- people will call it out.
well the least internet people will do anyway.pango - 'I'll be gone soon' lol it's Yurimon.set
- I posted what video? What are you talking about?IRNlun6
- This motion wasn't just a simple gesture that didn't receive considerable debate.IRNlun6
- Blasphemy laws exist in the EU, and a problem it creates is that it immediately frames the conversation in a negative light.IRNlun6
- let's just say sure they exist. (i'm not gonna look through every laws in EU). how is a motion to prevent bigotry towards islam, Blasphemy??pango
- Government shouldn't be passing these motions for penance to their pasts.IRNlun6
- and quite frankly i don't trust your judgment on what is Blasphemy.pango
- don't trust me. what's bigotry towards an ideology?IRNlun6
- look, I'm not dismissing communities having to live in fear.IRNlun6
- Yes. This motion is to condemn bigotry. Not to shield from criticism.pango
- when people are being killed for their believe. you don't think government should step in?pango
- "western nation cultural crisis" what culture are you losing? if you live in canada.pango
- the culture of being able to cause suffering to minority and get away with?pango
- please type your comments as fast as you can. so i don't cut it off.... i'll try to do the same.... =__=pango
- get away with it? I'm not Canadian but I'm certain people aren't allowed to get away with attacking people of any belief.IRNlun6
- The term Islamophobia has a much larger global context. Especially in today's world with war, refugees, and terror.IRNlun6
- yes. i know you don't live in canada. that's why i said "if you live in canada" multiple times.pango
- An issue that's put considerable pressure mainly in the Middle East and a Europe.IRNlun6
- it is none binding. it is not a law. it is a motion. it doesn't condemn criticism towards islam. It condemns attack n bigotry towards people who practice islampango
- It's very tough to talk about this in here. Jordan Peterson is a Professor at Toronto U that is much more articulate on this...IRNlun6
- your culture and free speech is completely intact. Even if you're canadian. which you're not.pango
- The whole idea of this imaginary "western civilisation" is so fucking purile and ridiculous. Like they have a monopoly on any of the values they call "Western"Khurram
- basically "white' civilization in another guise.Khurram
- ok one question. what culture are you losing? let's pretend you are Canadian.pango
- I heard Muslims hate hockey...
... thus it's virtually the end of Canada.
So long, 'murica JR!
<3PonyBoy - No, I don't mean White. The US, Canada, Europe... been multicultural societies for decades, for better or for worse.IRNlun6
- and what culture aspect are you losing?pango
- One could argue they may be 'multicultural' in citizenry, IRN... but even I have to admit the leadership of said Nations has been primarily pasty in skintone.PonyBoy
- I was incorrect to call this a law.IRNlun6
- free speech, a value we all very much share in the west. that's not saying other cultures wouldn't share that value.IRNlun6
- You will still be free to criticize islam even if this motion is law.pango
- perhaps hyperbolic but I see it as our crisis, and I see several speech related issues popping up on campuses or in our politics.IRNlun6
- I also mean West in terms of relative historical context and not some racial purity nonsense.IRNlun6
- ya i also see most people who protest this motion were from far right. or S.O.O https://en.wikipedia…pango
- we can all try to make connection however we want. but one thing certain about this motion.pango
- we can all try to make connection however we want. but one thing certain about this motion.pango
- you can still make criticism toward Islam. i'm repeating it because i want to make it very clear.pango
- I understand pango.IRNlun6
- And yes I'm not surprised far right groups would be against this just as jihadis would be for it. Extremists.IRNlun6
- Yes. We're not them! We're not them.
https://youtu.be/-F-…pango - IRN, get a grip, there's no threat to free speech here or in the United States. All that school stuff you're triggered about isn't law, it's just a classroom.monospaced
- Also, this isn't an extremist thing. It's about telling bigoted assholes to stop being cunts to peaceful muslims just because of their religion and origin.monospaced