Venezuela 2014
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- ernexbcn-2
I respectfully ask why all of you "concerned" about "outside influence" were so silent through all these years while cuban operatives were systematically inserted in key areas of the venezuelan government, including the military, national ID system and political police. Are you aware of the tortures they commit against political prisioners or military officials under their suspicions? Cuba's best import besides rum and cigars is repressive techniques, and venezuelans have been suffering that for years already, but hey let's cry about US meddling.
When Chávez mortgaged the country to Russia and China none of you even flinched, now we are in massive debt, due to huge loans in exchange of oil and that money was basically stolen.
We have almost A THOUSAND political prisoners, we haven't had free elections in years, every time a new "election" comes up the government jails whoever candidates they want based on hubris or simply bars the parties he doesn't like from participating. When people take the street to protest either the national guard or the civilian paramiltary of the government get to the streets and shoot live rounds to the people.
When the opposition won a majority of the national assembly the government ordered their supreme court to basically rule any law or decision coming from that elected power to be void, and they created a new assembly out of the air filled with people from the government party. But you are concerned now about outside influence.
Tell me, please, enlightened privileged beings, how are venezuelans suppose to deal with a government composed of criminals that pee on a daily basis on the constitution they created? thankfully we seem to have a way out ahead of us with the support of over 50 countries.
- TLDR: we need all the help we can get, send marines as a last resort if necessary, we are being ruled by stealing shitlords involved in drug dealing + moreernexbcn
- name 1 example in history where that plan worked out in favour of the people of the invaded country.
(I don't want to fight, nor defend the dictator in power).uan - Shouldn't you be calling the UN Peacekeepers instead of the US Army for help?uan
- My comments were really just about how the U.S. media covers situations like these. There is never any real debate about whether we should be involved,yuekit
- or what the plan is. Which you would think would be obvious questions to ask given the track record of almost total failure over the past 10-20 years.yuekit
- lol, do you really believe that the Trump administration gives a damn about the people of Venezuela?Milan
- uan: Panama - US got rid of a dictator/drug smuggler - and now look at panama. One of the more prosperous central american countries.hotroddy
- milan - it is in the interest of the US for Venezuela to be a stable country. They don't want the russians and chinese in their backyardhotroddy
- https://www.latimes.…yuekit
- ^ Looks like the military is actually resisting the idea of direct intervention. The pressure to invade is coming from people like John Bolton, who wasyuekit
- a big supporter of the Iraq War and more recently a Fox New commentator. Who knows what Trump himself thinks. Maybe you can see how this doesn’t exactly inspireyuekit
- confidence?yuekit
- Balkan's war is another great example of US leadership that stabilized a region.hotroddy
- and it did it on behalf of muslims who don't seem very appreciative of it.hotroddy
- ernexbcn0
This one is from yesterday:
https://www.nytimes.com/2019/05/…
Maduro's nephews are in jail in NYC for attempting to introduce a ton of cocaine into the US:
https://www.reuters.com/article/…
Not only they have ruined a country while enjoying absolute power for 20 years, but seeing they ruined all sources of income, including oil, they got involved in the very lucrative drug business.
This isn't about who is the president of the US at this moment, this is about a country being destroyed by a gang and the people trying to get rid of them. Never has been easier to pick the proper side, I think.
- people only want to hear the half of the story that fits their prejudiceFax_Benson
- Only option is full on nuking.PhanLo
- https://panampost.co…Gnash
- ^ Socialist Isis, what a weird combo.PhanLo
- Bueno, yo creo que estás claro que la democracia ahí no funciona. Lo que le queda al pueblo es levantarse, todavía están a tiempo.Maaku
- ^it doesn't work because it's not a democracyGnash
- deadsperm1
- does he also wear a 'I <3 Treason' t-shirt?uan
- https://i.imgur.com/…Gnash
- Pinochet overdid it and went way too far in his authoritarianism, so nobody remembers now he saved Chile from a way greater danger: soviet-controlled communism.shaft
- We don't usually see the global historical context and the danger Chile evaded with Pinochet. Communist Khmer Rouge had just murdered up to 3 million people.shaft
- Pinochet stabilised the economy and stepped down even though he didn't have to - what dictator does that?
Still, I agree he went too far, even if it was a war.shaft - economy (chicago boys) crashed in '82. he bailed banks out and bought for the nation some industries, chile had a hard time before economy recovered.uan
- the return to democracy respecting the constitution was a long way for chile, economy works 'cause it's a balancing act in free market and social securities.uan
- pr2-3
ernexbcn, have you even read an article on that website or Wikipedia - the place that can be edited at a moment's notice by anybody - is your main source of info? They are writing in-depth articles on how it's not as simple as mainstream media portrays.
Anybody who uses Wikipedia as a proof of anything either doesn't respect his/her peers in the discussion at hand or is simply a fool.
btw, i'm from ex-communist country.
- lol.. now you are arguing about facts?
https://venezuelanal…hotroddy - and all the 'contributers' live outside of venezuela. lolhotroddy
- So you agree that a regime change should avoid outside influence.deadsperm
- no, I think we need all the help we can get, and thankfully over 50 countries are supporting Guaidóernexbcn
- if you want discuss "outside influence" let's discuss the Cuban meddling in Venezuela for more than a decadeernexbcn
- I'm not interested in discussing "outside influence". I was just pointing out the logic of his argument.deadsperm
- lol.. now you are arguing about facts?
- yuekit4
It's fascinating to watch the U.S. politicians and media come together during moments like this. Suddenly you get the same talking points from Republicans, Democrats and major American news networks. Former enemies like Trump and CNN now marching in lockstep.
It must be an officially sanctioned U.S. regime change action. If only they had bothered to ask us taxpayers if we wanted to be involved in this...
- 911 Never Forget
https://en.wikipedia…deadsperm - 50 countries are behind the interim presidenternexbcn
- the US taxpayer couldn't find venezuela on the map, let alone understand the atrocities happening to the country by a group of criminals.hotroddy
- "we'll see who's putins bitch" said trumphotroddy
- deadsperm - that coup d'etat is the reason Chile is considered to be a first world nation amongst a third world continent. Pinoche got rid of all parasiteshotroddy
- Not defending the Venezuela government by any means. But isn't it strange when you have a media all 100% sold on intervention,yuekit
- when in fact hotroddy is not even exaggerating that almost no one in the US can point out Venezuela on a map??yuekit
- Look at the track record over the past decade...Iraq, Libya, Syria, all disasters, supported by the same people who are currently masterminding this.yuekit
- the difference venezuela is in the western hemisphere with an already westernized mentality.hotroddy
- do you want to impose an authoratative anti democratic gov't on these people who only want democratic elections to be held?hotroddy
- do you want venezuela converted to russian, cuban, iranian, north korean type gov't?hotroddy
- where the only ideology that resonates to their base is that they are anti US?hotroddy
- because they already failed economically speaking.hotroddy
- Every single one of the countries you mentioned are countries where the U.S. meddled, tried to invade or overthrew the government.yuekit
- and failed.hotroddy
- and are those counties democratic?hotroddy
- I'm saying the U.S. helped create those situations through their policies. What if Cuba had been handled differently for instance? It certainly didn't work toyuekit
- blockade them for half a century and hope that would get the government to step down.yuekit
- cuba would have fallen if it weren't for venezuela. Chavez stepped in big time after the collapse of soviet union at the expense of the venezuelan people.hotroddy
- in exchange for information on how to subjugate your citizens.hotroddy
- I don't know if that's true or not but one thing this sphere of influence stuff makes clear is that it's not about democracy vs. dictatorship. The U.S. supportsyuekit
- some of the worst dictatorships in the world such as Saudi Arabia where people are executed for opposing the government and decapitated bodies are hung fromyuekit
- buildings. It's more about power and control and it would be nice to know exactly what deal Trump and his cronies struck with Lopez and Guaido before we signyuekit
- off on some decades long, trillion dollar commitment to socially reengineer that country.yuekit
- the US had socially reengineered Venezuela in the 60's, 70's and 80's when it was the richest country in South America.hotroddy
- and US literally 'engineered' venezuela's economy by providing capital and skilled workers in exchange for oil.hotroddy
- they set up factories, set up schools., transformed it from a banana republic into a very modern state.hotroddy
- Lopez is harvard educated, Guaido is an mechanical engineer so let's hope they struck the deal.hotroddy
- It's all for the greater good.
Pinochet did nothing wrong.deadsperm
- 911 Never Forget
- pr2-6
Tons of great content if you can only pull your head out of Left or Right camp ass:
https://venezuelanalysis.com/- sorry mate, that's a pro venezuelan government outlet, they've been doing propaganda for the regime for over a decadeernexbcn
- we know where your head is stuck.hotroddy
- it's black and white. not left and right. either your democratic or anti democratic.hotroddy
- venezuela analysis won't show the cell videos of protestors dragged out of their homes by gov't thugs and shot on the streethotroddy
- by armed gangs on motorcycleshotroddy
- but it's nice to see you found a echo chamber to support your theoretical ideology.hotroddy
- hot, where else will you see/read about the armed gangs on motorcycles of the regime opposition, doing the very same thing?pr2
- not sure what videos you are watching as the opposition don't have guns.hotroddy
- ernexbcn0
"Gregory Wilpert is one of the two co-founders of venezuelanalysis.com, together with Martin Sánchez, when the site launched in September 2003. He was the site’s main editor for six years, until 2009, and continues to do volunteer work for venezuelanalysis.com and is on the site’s Board of Directors. The Global Post described Wilpert as "perhaps the most prominent Chavista." Wilpert's wife Carol Delgado was named Consul General of Venezuela in New York in 2008."
This dude has been sucking that teat since 2003, he's a mercenary of the Chavez regime.
- btw I'm venezuelanernexbcn
- there was another guy on qbn who was venezuelan and into the culture qbn promotes. I often wonder what happened to him: https://www.qbn.com/…hotroddy
- he was living in venezuela during the 2014 riotshotroddy
- NBQ000
Shit hitting the fan it seems...
- A good insight into how UK will be under Corebin (deliberate misspelling).shapesalad
- Ramanisky21
Just happened
- "We need government!!" **puts fist in air
"Uh-oh, government bad!!" **throws rock
"We demand you rule us good!!" **gets run over by military vehiclebliznutty
- "We need government!!" **puts fist in air
- yuekit0
Let's say the opposition was able to take power. What would they do differently in order to fix everything?
- I mean clearly if you could go back in time 10 years...but at this point the country is massively in debt to foreign creditors. It's like Greece x 1000.yuekit
- one big difference is Venezuela has an estimated $14.3 trillion worth of natural resources. But somehow they aren't able to exploit this potential wealth.uan
- for one they'd be rid of a dictatorGnash
- unfortunately the destruction is so bad it will take decades to recover.hotroddy
- and most of the business that operated pre-chavez will never return.hotroddy
- some in the opposition want dolarize the economy. worked well for Ecuador. however it may cause even more suffering in the short termhotroddy
- gnash is correct, getting rid of a dictator and his group of illiterate criminal thugs is the first step.hotroddy
- yes, but the price Venezuela will pay for an invasion might not be what the people and the country need.
They need to get rid of the dictator by themselves.uan - ^ yup.Gnash
- Top Military ranks are too corrupt. Mid ranks are too scared bc many have already been jailed. Cubans have infiltrated the ranks and act like spies.hotroddy
- I know it will surprise - but most in the country are asking for a military invasion. It's the USA and allies who are not willing to pay the price.hotroddy
- and I understand. Why should we put American lives at risk? Not worth it to most.hotroddy
- The Monroe Doctrine is Venezuela's only hope.hotroddy
- How much of the population still favors Maduro? Do you think there is a prospect of civil war if the government was overthrown?yuekit
- So many times the U.S. has tried to "solve" a situation like this and it turns into an even worse disaster.yuekit
- ^ absolutely .Gnash
- Independent polls have pro-regime supporter at 10-15%. But the gov't will tell you it's at 80%.hotroddy
- the opposition consist of mostly unarmed civilians. The regime have all the guns.hotroddy
- Not has Maduro armed civilians that are above the law and act with impunity but Maduro has also given refuge you colombian paramilitary groups (ELN, FARC)hotroddy
- which control large portions of venezuela's interiorhotroddy
- so their won't be any civil war.. even though Maduro is fully committed in watching the country spiral into a blood bath.hotroddy
- They are quite content into watching the country sink further as long as they are in control of $$$hotroddy
- jeez.. excuse all my grammar errorshotroddy
- I was speculating about a civil war IF the government was toppled...what happens with all those heavily armed paramilitary groups you mentioned.yuekit
- The gov't planned for this (the only thing they planned) and many think an IRAQ scenario would unfold.hotroddy
- But I don't think many would risk their lives fighting for a failed 'cuban ideology'. Caribbean culture is not Arab culture or Vietcong culture.hotroddy
- the paramilitary groups (FARC etc) in the interior will fight. But the 'collectivos' won't risk their lives.hotroddy
- colectivos are armed mafia gangs that the gov't funds to control the streetshotroddy
- https://www.google.c…hotroddy
- https://www.youtube.…hotroddy
- Milan3
The propaganda line for Venezuela right now is, “We want to help the poor Venezuelans.” Well, if you want to help them, then keep America out of their face. Don’t force them to have anything to do with the country that came up with drive-through fried food served in a bucket and opioid nasal sprays. At no point does anyone look at the Donald Trump presidency and think, “Wow, that country really has things figured out. I hope they bring some of their great decision-making to our doorstep.”
- hotroddy3
It’s 5:39 a.m. while I write this. Power came back to my Caracas neighborhood around an hour ago. During the last three days, Venezuela has experienced a nation-wide blackout: we’ve only had power intermittently in Caracas and many states in Venezuela have had none. I’ll know how my day will go, driving around to try to buy food or find a place to charge my phone if the power goes out again, all of this before the sun sets and that dreaded darkness falls again upon us.
The nights are the worst for me. We have to lock ourselves in our houses to avoid the unthinkable dangers of the darker version of the most dangerous city in the world. People shout from the windows to vent out their anger: “¡Maduro, coño de tu madre!”. They start counting from one from each apartment, they sing the national anthem... anything to release anger, ease fear and keep themselves sane.
The artificial character of the modern world has never been starker for me than during these days. Now that only cash, especially U.S. dollars, is accepted in the few stores that are open, the relative value of money is an abstract idea; the money in the bank is only worth something as a unit of exchange if there’s power and a system to process it. Otherwise, it’s just a bunch of figures in a computer that only people who live in a non-failed state can see.
However, one recent innovation on an old technology, that of books, is helping me a lot. I know hating Jeff Bezos is trendy nowadays in the U.S., but my charged Amazon Kindle is my last remaining connection to any idea of civilization. E. M. Forster’s vivid description of the class system in an Edwardian England that has more electricity than Caracas in 2019, in Howard’s End, is a balm for my exhausted soul.
After 20 years of hatred, incompetence, viciousness and lies, it’s difficult to find a shred of hope amid the chaos, even when you have the luxury of going online. Compared to telling your frantic family and friends abroad that you are ok, writing a burn in 280 characters about an already ravaged country plummeting to death while the psychopaths responsible for this remain at large seems painfully naive, seems a waste of precious bandwidth that should be used for more important business. But then I’m reminded that the written word is one of the few tools left to document these dark hours, and I’m using these precious time while I have power to state that I refuse to be broken by an evil system that has been trying to crush me into submission for 20 years.
I also need to ask anyone reading this to help Venezuelans see the light again. We need you. We’re a resilient nation, but we can’t do this on our own.
- hotroddy-1
Mike Pompeo at the UN does a pretty spot on summery:
- oh fuck right offMilan
- like this twat cares about any of those people. these US warmongers have proven that countless times, but this time it's different?Milan
- the US helped build Venezuela to be the richest nation in Latin America before Chavez. So yes, its been done before and can be done again.hotroddy
- i know its painful for to you to hear that.hotroddy
- why did they elect chavez then? you think they got sick of their wealth?uan
- chavez sold them snake oil and false dream. Plus they wanted to stick it to the 1%. The 1% that created a middle class that is no longer.hotroddy
- and yes, they are only realizing now how good they had it. They were poor but had running water, electricity, and FOOD which they don't have todayhotroddy
- so, they were rich but nevertheless wanted to stick it to the 1% and fell for a demagogue for 14 consecutive years.uan
- The first 6 years were grea. They nationalized indurstries and operating them in debt. But that's ok because oil was at 160 a barrelhotroddy
- And Price controls killed local production. And they keep doubling down ignoring the cause of inflation.hotroddy
- And you forget these people are THUGS that want to convert Venezuela into madmax because that's the only world they know they can survive and thrive.hotroddy
- They've armed civilians who are above the law do whatever it takes to intimidate and execute if necessary.hotroddy
- what no one talks about is how they use race / colonialism/ imperialism as a reason to justify the destruction.hotroddy
- "they hate us because of the color of our skin" he once said on national broadcasthotroddy
- lay off the cnn there hotroddy, it's bad for your health.. obviouslyMilan
- my family lived it buddy. CNN would never air what I just saidhotroddy
- sounds more like a trauma that was caused by injustice from higher powers...those things take generations to heal:/uan
- today I was browsing radio stations from venezuela, hard to tell if I found any good stations, but all are broadcasting lots of commercials, that surprised me.uan
- but in general they sound like a normal country very aware of the problems the country is facing. heard some reasonable voices calling for unity left and right.uan
- heard also some calls that got shut down, when the caller started to promote ideologies.uan
- most of private radio stations have been forced off air. If you say anything critical- they remove your licence and steal are your equipment.hotroddy
- it's not about left and right anymore. Its about a group of crimimal thugs that have taken control of the countryhotroddy
- Sounds like what Tman is trying to do here. Makes sense.formed
- hotroddy-3
- hotroddy-2
going on 50 hours now:
- hotroddy-2
entire country without power for 40 hours
- What a shame...what could possibly go wrong next?utopian
- popcorn.gifhotroddy
- arresting doctors for calling on humanitarian aid
https://www.facebook…hotroddy - Looks like #commicortez got her wish. No power for you.Hayoth
- It's called socialism, dolt.utopian
- bright side is there's no food in the fridge to spoilhotroddy
- Fax_Benson1
This is an interesting read.
- from 2017Fax_Benson
- +1fadein11
- chavez fooled everyone.hotroddy
- and for author to admit he supported him because of his race would be considered racism if it were trumphotroddy
