Question for experienced print designers 2323 Responses

Last post: 3 years ago | Thread started: Apr 28, 10, 7:19 a.m.

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• AVAVA

  Hello chaps and chapettes,

  If you are used to working with fashion brands, I wanted to pick your brains...

  I've been asked to quote for designing a 45 page fashion catalogue, and although I have got print experience, I have never done a large catalogue for a high fashion brand, so my questions are:

  a. In your experience how long would something like this take a designer to design all the elements together for final artwork?

  b. What kind of budget (excluding the print) would you roughly estimate for a job like this.

  thanks in advance.

  A

  Apr 28, 10, 7:19 a.m. – Permalink

• Gucci

  I can't spend too much time writing, but as a word of advice, If I were to quote the project, I'd do it per page.

  That way if the page count fluctuates you're covered.

  

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  Dog-earApr 28, 10, 7:29 a.m. – Permalink

• capn_ron

  There are a lot of questions you would need to answer before this is a quotable job. Are you going to be receiving photos from them, or do you have to art direct photo shoots as well. You may want to ask them if they have a budget already in mind. Other questions are if that budget includes printing. Are the products all shot already, or do you need to art direct studio photography?

  These are just a few of the questions I would be asking. The other part that makes it hard to estimate time is on how fast you are in InDesign. Once you have a look and style sheets, it goes pretty quick, but those take time to design and make look good. 45 pages is a good sized book and you don't want to short yourself, so I would ask those questions and then overestimate the time you think it will take to do the job.

  

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  Dog-earApr 28, 10, 7:29 a.m. – Permalink

• AVAVA

  Great responses guys, thank you.

  Gucci - Per page is wise, will bear that in mind.

  Capn_ron - Good questions, thank you.

  • They would supply all shots from the shoot and should be ready to use - although it is worth me asking if they are expecting me to retouch the shots - just incase they view that as part of the job I suppose...

  • They have mentioned a budget - as always this is not the true budget - but they have asked me to quote in any case, as their budget may not be realistic etc...

  • Not sure if this includes printing - I bloody hope not!

  • I would say I am intermediate Indesign user, but not very fast, I am a bit precious on getting the designs 'just so' etc.. so that may slow me down also...

  • 45 pages is a fair size, so I think I will quote per page I guess.

  Cheers
  A

  

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  Dog-earApr 28, 10, 8:14 a.m. – Permalink

• tasty

  get paid in trident layers gum.

  • apple/pinapple is the tastiest.– monNom

  

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  Dog-earApr 28, 10, 8:17 a.m. – Permalink

• AVAVA

  Tasty - A nice thought there, but don't think that's going to work.
  ----

  I guess what I should have asked you guys, is if there is a set of questions that you ask your clients before doing this type of job....

  

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  Dog-earApr 28, 10, 8:55 a.m. – Permalink

• capn_ron

  budget would be the main question. Then (when it is a lot less than you want to do the job for) ask for what you think it is worth to you. Don't skimp out here because you'll end up mad at the project in the end. If you make what you're worth you'll be happy.

  

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  Dog-earApr 28, 10, 9:16 a.m. – Permalink

• dMullins

  Don't quote per page, quote per signature. Given how signatures are setup, I might use this idea in a "range" quote, instead of price-per-page. So each additional signature set = bump in price, not each individual page.

  

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  Dog-earApr 28, 10, 9:34 a.m. – Permalink

• d_rek

  If you're thinking in billable hours i've done two books in the last year.

  120+ hours for a 6.5x9", 64 pg, signature bound, 4CP offset printed Supplemental Reader for a Museum. Supplied Copy and Images with many rounds of copy editing and revision.

  60 hours for a 50 pg perfect bound book, supplied copy, had to acquire images from media galleries/stock photos.

  

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  Dog-earApr 28, 10, 10:05 a.m. – Permalink

• sisu

  Now try explaining signatures to the client. Charge by the hour, wtf.

  

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  Dog-earApr 28, 10, 10:05 a.m. – Permalink

• AVAVA

  thanks D_rek - Just out of curiosity, what did you set as a day rate charge for those projects?

  A

  

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  Dog-earApr 28, 10, 10:34 a.m. – Permalink

• AVAVA

  sorry - I meant hourly charge...

  

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  Dog-earApr 28, 10, 10:34 a.m. – Permalink

• d_rek

  I work for a small firm. Our going rate is around $200/day for design services. So break it down...

  8hr average work day (realistically 10-12)
  120 / 8 = 15 days
  200 / 8 = $25/hr
  15 x $200 = $3,000

  Although if you're going at it as a freelancer you can (and probably will want to) charge more.

  Also FYI... the 120hr number is purely design+production. It did not include meetings and/or research.

  • Your company charges $25/hr???
    How do you manage that?– monNom1/2

    my numbers probably aren't accurate– d_rek2/2

  

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  Dog-earApr 28, 10, 10:48 a.m. – Permalink

• i_monk

  45 pages is impossible.

  44 or 46, pick one.

  Unless you mean 90.

  • how is 46 going to work? you need page numbers to be divisible by 4.– Amicus1/3

    By 46, he must have meant 48...– duckofrubber2/3

    48 is a standard... 44 is wasting paper unless you have a bizarre format.
    – maikel3/3

  

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  Dog-earApr 28, 10, 11:01 a.m. – Permalink

• AVAVA

  Thanks for the info D_rek.

  i_monk - yup good point - Ill take 44.

  

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  Dog-earApr 28, 10, 11:16 a.m. – Permalink

• vaxorcist

  make DAMN sure you have a contract that spells out that the client is responsible for final press check....

  I worked for a small agency that was almost bankrupted by a client demanding a huge job be reprinted because they didn't notice an error that only they could have found... i.e. not a typo, but wrong info....

  • << +1 - absolutely essential– DoktorDavid

  

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  Dog-earApr 28, 10, 1:51 p.m. – Permalink

• AVAVA

  Another fine point - thanks Vaxo!

  

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  Dog-earMay 6, 10, 4:49 a.m. – Permalink

• maikel

  Quote per hour. You know better than anybody else how much an hour of your time is worth. Consider design, meetings, amends, ask about proof read, photo editing (you will need some retouching regardless) and production sourcing/qa. Think about your printing costs. More often than not you will need to proof your book, and let's say you have to print the whole lot a few times, there's over a 100 decent colour printed copies. Oh, and if you don't have yet a set of standard terms&conds make sure you get one beforehand.

  Once you got your number, do it times 1,5 and add VAT.

  ...and after all that, if you like the project, probably you will end up taking it on whatever money they want to pay you.

  

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  Dog-earMay 6, 10, 5:26 a.m. – Permalink

• Christa

  Quote a flat fee to assemble all the elements and layout which includes one round of revisions (minor proofing edits) and say that additional pages or revisions will be hourly-----and that's where you'll make all your money, clients are never as organized in their process as you are

  

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  Dog-earMay 6, 10, 5:55 a.m. – Permalink

• AVAVA

  Good stuff thanks.

  

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  Dog-earMay 12, 10, 5:17 a.m. – Permalink

• vaxorcist

  have a "change request form" that has to be signed off on, or accepted via email.... ammunition forwhen bean counter questions why final bill is different from estimate

  

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  Dog-earMay 12, 10, 7:08 a.m. – Permalink